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What To Do With Mike Green?

from Helene St. James of the Detroit Free Press,

Green is headed toward unrestricted free agency next summer, so his future hinge ties into how competitive the Wings are. If they are in the playoff picture in the month leading up to the trade deadline, the Wings could reach out to discuss a one-to-two year extension in the $4.5 million range. If Green is not amenable to that, or if the Wings are out of the playoff race, it makes sense to follow the blueprint from this past spring and trade him for a draft pick.

The Wings have a new defenseman in Trevor Daley, and while Ryan Sproul lacked assertiveness when he got into the lineup, he has not had much of a real chance to gain a foothold in Detroit. Then there is money to consider – next summer sees the expiration of contracts for Dylan Larkin and Anthony Mantha (as well as Petr Mrazek, for that matter), and $6 million off the books would help cover those extensions.

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Comments

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If they traded him now, even with max retained salary, they could get an okay return (d-men are moving at a premium) and clear enough space to get AA re-signed.

Posted by BarryKlob on 08/09/17 at 10:00 AM ET

MurrayChadwick's avatar

Returns are typically better to the seller at the deadline, and buyer in the summer, assuming productivity health, etc. etc.  Sell him in 2018.

Posted by MurrayChadwick from Holland Hate Hyperbole Town (HHHT) on 08/09/17 at 10:29 AM ET

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Tavares situation has to be followed closely this season. If he might become UFA next summer, we better have room to have a chance at him.

Posted by VPalmer on 08/09/17 at 10:47 AM ET

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Nobody is adding $6M to their roster at this point.

Never mind that Ken Holland wouldn’t trade someone who could help the Wings make the playoffs.

He’ll be traded at the deadline, unless the Wings are close (in Ken Holland’s estimation) to making the playoffs, in which case he’ll be lost for nothing.

Posted by CharDeeMacDennis on 08/09/17 at 10:48 AM ET

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If he might become UFA next summer, we better have room to have a chance at him.

Room to sign him won’t mean the Wings will have anything resembling a chance to sign him.

Posted by CharDeeMacDennis on 08/09/17 at 10:49 AM ET

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Posted by MurrayChadwick from Holland Hate Hyperbole Town (HHHT) on 08/09/17 at 11:29 AM ET

I’m becoming more doubtful of getting a decent return for Green even at the deadline. With the upcoming draft being rich with talent even a late 1st round might be difficult to pry out of a team….....but there’s always teams like NYR and Toronto who give me some hope.

Posted by VPalmer on 08/09/17 at 11:47 AM ET

why do you think Tavares would want to come to Detroit? What could Holland possibly have to offer him besides money?

Nobody is adding $6M to their roster at this point.
Posted by CharDeeMacDennis on 08/09/17 at 11:48 AM ET

I think the critical question is more, what team could be willing who has both the cap space and needs a RH Dman on loan?

thinking about whether Green is resigned, if traded it seems like the new team would likely take a wait and see approach to Green. He’s getting into the “old” category and it’s best to see what he is still capable of , if the injury bug starts to bite and/or to have a better negotiating position if he under performs. With that said, it seems like only a team that really needs a RH Dman would consider Green early in the season.

With that said, HSJ’s is off her rocker again. Green should be gone after this season. His cap space is desperately needed for younger players (Mantha and Larkin) and his spot on the roster will be useful to get a younger Dman up to the NHL.

Is there a franchise Dman headed to UFA next summer that Holland could “kick the tires” on?

Posted by howeandhowe from Seattle on 08/09/17 at 11:05 AM ET

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unless the Wings are close (in Ken Holland’s estimation) to making the playoffs, in which case he’ll be lost for nothing.

Most probable scenario with Green signing another 3 year deal with us in mid season being close second.

Posted by VPalmer on 08/09/17 at 11:22 AM ET

TreKronor's avatar

I see him being traded at the deadline.  Honestly, I’d love to see Washington pick him up and make a solid run - I feel like all he did for that franchise 6, 7, 8 years ago, he deserves a Cup with them.  But I would doubt they’ll have room for him, and that they’d actually eventually win a Cup.

He was a good Dman for us last year on a team with really bad dmen, so I just hope he can continue to be steady.  If he has a good showing, he could fetch us a 2nd rounder, maybe a 1st, honestly, at the deadline.

Posted by TreKronor on 08/09/17 at 11:23 AM ET

Colin's avatar

so his future hinge ties into how competitive the Wings are.

Just some excellent writing right here. Does HSJ even proof her work? I don’t expect her to be a good journalist for obvious reasons, but nonsense phrases like “so his future hinge ties into…” make me seriously consider auditioning to take her job. The funny thing too, is that “so his future hinges on” is a much better and more descriptive choice than “so his future ties into” anyway.

Now on topic:

Green should absolutely be moved at the deadline, and thanks to him going to UFA next offseason, we can retain half his salary with no concerns whatsoever.

I’ll hope for a 1st but settle for a 2nd & a 3rd. Hell, I’d even consider a good prospect in return.

Should we re-sign him? Absolutely NOT.

Posted by Colin from Ken Holland's new yacht, "Incompetence" on 08/09/17 at 11:49 AM ET

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Green should absolutely be moved at the deadline, and thanks to him going to UFA next offseason, we can retain half his salary with no concerns whatsoever.

Why do people think the Wings are going to need to eat any of his salary at the deadline?  Assuming he has even a decent year there will be several teams kicking his tires and no need to eat any salary.

Posted by CharDeeMacDennis on 08/09/17 at 11:58 AM ET

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Yes not many teams have $6M of cap space at this point. But maybe try to think more creatively. I know that’s difficult since our GM appears to have no capacity to think creatively either.

But consider something like this…

Mike Green to Edmonton. In return, the worst contract on your books is Mark Fayne, making $3.625M to play in the AHL. We’ll take him. Now add a 1st rounder. We get an extra 2nd or 3rd if he re-signs with you guys. Net salary impact is we shed $2.4M and they add $2.4M. Both numbers work far better than $6M.

How about Toronto. You can have Green. We’ll take out trash like Lupul and put him on LTIR. In return, we’ll take a 1st or a premier prospect. Then the Leafs can waive Marchenko to make room for Green.

A trade could be done. Right now. But as someone said, Kenny still has ambitions to get 2% and be back in the mix of things. So trading Green is not on his radar. Probably never even a single discussion. Let’s see where we are at the trade deadline and then make a decision. Yawn. Let’s see where we are at after training camp and then figure out the cap. Yawn. He just kicks the can down the road on everything.

Posted by fatsavage on 08/09/17 at 12:15 PM ET

MurrayChadwick's avatar

I’m becoming more doubtful of getting a decent return for Green even at the deadline.

Posted by howeandhowe from Seattle on 08/09/17 at 12:05 PM ET

I think we will get a strong return, but it depends on expectations, and demand. If decent is 2 1st rounders, no way, but I think the package will be favorable. 

I did not think the Wings would get a lot for Vanek (correct) because of the market and the limited teams who would need an offense only winger, considering who was in the hunt, but I also didn’t think we get squat for Smith and was woefully incorrect.  Thinking of Smith, and considering what Shittenkirk went for points to the trade deadline premium afforded to a rental dman, but it also might scare the market this year.

Posted by MurrayChadwick from Holland Hate Hyperbole Town (HHHT) on 08/09/17 at 12:55 PM ET

WingedRider's avatar

Now the Wings have to trade decent players to fix the Cap full of crippled useless players that can’t be traded.  That sounds like a good idea. NOT

I agree Green has to be traded, probably at the deadline.  Which non useless player will have to be traded for PICKS next?

Wings Cap solution

Posted by WingedRider from Saskatoon, SK on 08/09/17 at 01:52 PM ET

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A trade could be done.

Not either of the scenarios you’ve suggested.

Toronto gets instant relief from Lupul’s contract the second they put him on LTIR, so why would it be worth a first for them to get rid of it?

Edmonton has sixteen million in cap room, why would they give up a first to create $2.6M more in cap room than they would have by simply sending Fayne to the minors?

Creativity is one thing, nonsense is a completely different thing.

 

Posted by CharDeeMacDennis on 08/09/17 at 01:55 PM ET

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Toronto gets instant relief from Lupul’s contract the second they put him on LTIR, so why would it be worth a first for them to get rid of it?

Toronto already has Horton’s $5.3M on LTIR. When you add another $5.25M from Lupul it’s over and above what can be stashed on LTIR. So dumping Lupul and replacing with Green can help them. I also mentioned other moving parts are needed to make it work.

Edmonton has sixteen million in cap room, why would they give up a first to create $2.6M more in cap room than they would have by simply sending Fayne to the minors?

That $16M doesn’t include Draisitl. I’d budget at least $8M for him. They are also actively pursuing another top 9 forward that will use up more cap space. Is there still enough for Green’s full $6M. Yeah maybe. But including Fayne would give them more flexibility at the deadline. Remember, some teams like to leave cap space to bolster their playoff rosters. Edmonton has no reason to spend to the cap this season while McDavid is making less than $1M. The year after is when hard decisions are needed. I’d also add that with Sekera injured, Green is the perfect veterans to step in and help run that PP. He’s an Alberta guy. He provides some good leadership. He has the puck skills to complement their forwards. Edmonton’s 1st is likely going to be in the 20-30 range. This is a team that is all in to win right now, before the McDavid contract kicks in and forces them to shed assets. 

Creativity is one thing, nonsense is a completely different thing.

Thanks.

Posted by CharDeeMacDennis on 08/09/17 at 02:55 PM ET

 

Posted by fatsavage on 08/09/17 at 02:27 PM ET

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ok so here is a dream…

We trade Green and a combination of Tatar/Gus/Abby/Helm , as many as possible, tp Washington.  We retain all but 3.5 million in salary for a year.  They give us a boat load of picks/prospects.  Or some picks and a bag of pucks.  We would have enough money to sign AA/Russo, and promote you to fill slots.  ala full rebuild.  We let what happens happen.  maybe end up with a lottery pick.

Washington is nearing the end of their push to get a cup with AO, they need 4 players to get to 21 and they have 4mm in cap space.

I know NTC/NMC from our side, but they can name teams, and if its a shot at the cup why not.

Well its a dream.

Washington is going to have to be creative in the next few years, especially of Ovechkin’s results declime compared to the cap hit.

Posted by murph1jj on 08/09/17 at 02:49 PM ET

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ok so here is a dream

OK, if we are dreaming, we sign Tavares next summer and Doughty in 2019:)

Posted by VPalmer on 08/09/17 at 02:54 PM ET

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Toronto already has Horton’s $5.3M on LTIR.

Toronto is in the midst of their own rebuild, and they’ve done what you want Holland to do. WHY would a team in the midst of a rebuild want to start giving away first rounders for a one-year rental of a veteran defenseman who would be third or fourth on their depth chart and would be the highest paid defenseman and isn’t going to help them in the long run?

That $16M doesn’t include Draisitl. I’d budget at least $8M for him. They are also actively pursuing another top 9 forward that will use up more cap space.

And which part of that explains why they would want Green? He would be their third-best offensive defenseman but would be the highest paid.

Never mind that your suggestion is to get a first rounder from two teams that have been built around first rounders.

This is a team that is all in to win right now

Yeah.  Sure they are.

before the McDavid contract kicks in and forces them to shed assets.

Did you miss the part where the Oilers have 16 million in space? Give Draisaitl $8M and they still have $8M in cap space, PLUS whatever the cap goes up next year.

They’re not Chicago or Pittsburgh, they don’t have any reason to shed assets any time soon. And if they do, they have actual tradeable assets, so they’re not going to have to start begging for help.

Not to mention that trading Fayne wouldn’t help since he’s off the books in a year anyhow.

Next?

Posted by CharDeeMacDennis on 08/09/17 at 02:56 PM ET

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Posted by VPalmer on 08/09/17 at 03:54 PM ET

Darn, that was going to be the second part after the salary retention dropped off lol.

Posted by murph1jj on 08/09/17 at 02:56 PM ET

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The Oilers have cap space this year only because the McDavid deal doesnt kick in until 2018-19 season, after that the 16million goes down to 3 million. So no you dont have 8 million for Draisaitl and 8 million for someone else. Taking Green makes sense because he would be a pure rental from the Trade deadline through the playoffs. Edmonton can only take on expiring contracts and will be rotating players like Chicago does with their 20million dollar twins.

Posted by kwood15 on 08/09/17 at 08:07 PM ET

bigfrog's avatar

He’ll be traded at the deadline, unless the Wings are close (in Ken Holland’s estimation) to making the playoffs, in which case he’ll be lost for nothing.

.

True and true. Ken Holland will hold onto Green as long as he thinks the Red Wings have a shot at the playoffs. If not Green will be traded for what ever Holland can get at the trade deadline. I don’t think Green will be lost for nothing. confused

Posted by bigfrog on 08/09/17 at 08:59 PM ET

Colin's avatar

Why do people think the Wings are going to need to eat any of his salary at the deadline?  Assuming he has even a decent year there will be several teams kicking his tires and no need to eat any salary.

Posted by CharDeeMacDennis on 08/09/17 at 12:58 PM ET

Of course there will, but the cheaper you make him the bigger the market can be. Considering we would be doing a salary dump and playing young, cheap players in his place and his contract is expiring, its well worth it to retain salary to maximize his value. At the end of the season the retained salary becomes irrelevant.

I’d retain half.

Posted by Colin from Ken Holland's new yacht, "Incompetence" on 08/10/17 at 07:52 AM ET

MurrayChadwick's avatar

Posted by Colin on 08/10/17 at 08:52 AM ET

Amen. This is one of these items, where I shake my head, hopefully that’s not “insulting” anyone.

Who gives a rip what portion of the salary we eat? Why stop at 1/2 are we saving space for a roster player in return?  Eat every penny allowable by the league, it gives you the largest pool of bidders to bid against each other and drive up the return package.

Do the same with Mrazek if it gives you a higher return.

Retaining capspace enhances return, and we have no need for it.

Posted by MurrayChadwick from Holland Hate Hyperbole Town (HHHT) on 08/10/17 at 08:39 AM ET

Colin's avatar

Posted by MurrayChadwick from Holland Hate Hyperbole Town (HHHT) on 08/10/17 at 09:39 AM ET

You misspelled Howard, Murray.

Posted by Colin from Ken Holland's new yacht, "Incompetence" on 08/10/17 at 09:14 AM ET

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The Malik Report is a destination for all things Red Wings-related. I offer biased, perhaps unprofessional-at-times and verbose coverage of my favorite team, their prospects and developmental affiliates. I've joined the Kukla's Korner family with five years of blogging under my belt, and I hope you'll find almost everything you need to follow your Red Wings at a place where all opinions are created equal and we're all friends, talking about hockey and the team we love to follow.

 

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