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What Advice Would You Give To Andreas Athanasiou?

The hot topic of Detroit's preseason revolves around a player who is not in camp.

Let's say AA reads The Malik Report, what would you say to him?

Sign now, stay strong, get another agent are a few of the comments KK members have made in the recent past.

This post is yours, let your thoughts be known.

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Paul's avatar

In case you missed it last week, Ansar Khan of Mlive reported the Wings offer is $1.9M while Athanasiou is looking for $2.5M.

Posted by Paul from Motown Area on 09/25/17 at 07:16 AM ET

Nathan's avatar

AA doesn’t need advice. But Ken Holland sure needs it by the truckload.

Posted by Nathan from the scoresheet! on 09/25/17 at 07:51 AM ET

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Sign on the line which is dotted.

Posted by CharDeeMacDennis on 09/25/17 at 07:52 AM ET

Colin's avatar

Get a new agent, Andreas.

You’re an exciting player with a high ceiling, but you’re too young to be wasting any development opportunity over amounts of money that are only really significant to your working-class fans. $1.9m/yr is a lot of money already for a young player, and in 2 years with arbitration rights you’ll be able to take Kenny to the cleaners. Agents having a young contract holdout or two is one thing, but this guy seems to always have young players in holdouts, which tells me he cares a hell of a lot more about his own finances than your future. We need you on this team, and you need to keep developing and showing the hockey world just how good you are. When you’ve retired more than 10 years from now, you won’t be looking back and regretting the $1.2m difference between your bridge contract and what you wanted. You’ll be looking back at all the memorable plays you’ve made.

Posted by Colin from Ken Holland's new yacht, "Incompetence" on 09/25/17 at 08:04 AM ET

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Get a new agent. This guy is doing you a disservice by not advising you to get back to playing the game you love.

Be the first player to roll with an incentive based contract. Sign for the 1.9 million over 2 years, but have the incentive in your contract to pay you 500k for each season you surpass 50 points. Or have them roll those incentives into your next contract because you have now proven to management you are worth it.

Posted by JaySayers on 09/25/17 at 08:12 AM ET

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No one wants to live in Russia. Sign the contract and get on the ice. The offer from
Detroit is fair.

Posted by easmus on 09/25/17 at 08:28 AM ET

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Speaking of Russia, I looked up the KHL city that was confirmed to have
offered Jagr a deal and it’s way in the hinterlands, deep in Tatarstan - looks
like an oil town. Maybe that’s why they can pay him.

But boy, nowhere near Czechia or any of the bigger cities in eastern Europe.
it is not as large city and you can imagine the travel for a guy Jagr’s age.

It can’t be the most comfortable option for a guy from Canada who’s hoping to
really break out this season. Olympics or not.

AA is not going to win this one, but I wish Holland had started higher and
hope both sides still have some give.

No idea if the agent is the crucial variable holding this up.

Posted by Lefty30 on 09/25/17 at 09:01 AM ET

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Get on the ice.  There’s zero benefit to not being with the Wings at this stage.  You need to be on the ice and at your best for the next couple of years.  That will impact future contracts, ones where you can potentially make a lot of money.

Posted by Steve1306 on 09/25/17 at 09:03 AM ET

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My advice…don’t take advice from readers of a blog. Just kidding.

Real advice…some fans understand this probably isn’t just about money. Getting away from Kenny and Blash might be a bigger factor here. So either go to the KHL and come back a year later hoping you negotiate with a new regime. Fat chance. So just sign a 2-year deal and maybe quietly ask for a trade. Waiting a couple weeks into the season when we start 3-6-1 might swing some leverage back in your favour and squeeze out a couple hundred grand. I would do that at this stage.

Posted by fatsavage on 09/25/17 at 09:04 AM ET

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You only live once kid.
You can get beheaded at center ice on the first shift of the season.
Get your money while you can.

Posted by WingDing71 on 09/25/17 at 09:11 AM ET

Temo's avatar

If playing in the NHL is your dream then sign the contract. I realize money is a factor but you’re still a young guy and you have many years left to get paid. Play now and get paid later. The more you can show what you’re capable of, the higher your next salary will be.

Posted by Temo from La Capital, Míchígán on 09/25/17 at 09:32 AM ET

MurrayChadwick's avatar

Your pride’s effin’ with you. Eff pride! Pride only hurts, it never helps.

You and your agent played a well prepared hand, you did about everything you could do, but Kenny called your bluff, and now the game is over, there’s is nothing left to do but buck up, be a man, and sign the contract.

At this point you are now hurting yourself on the ice, your standing with the team, fan support (which is slowly turning) and even your image outside of Detroit, all of which impacts your value on your next contract, and the contract after, where the real dollars are to be made, not $600K. 

Not to mention, there is a lot of speculation that had you signed (maybe still IF), Sheehan would be traded, and that opens up more ice time for everyone on the roster, including you and possibly in different situations.

Posted by MurrayChadwick from Holland Hate Hyperbole Town (HHHT) on 09/25/17 at 09:39 AM ET

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Meet Holland somewhere in the middle.  Sign a contract.  Get on ice.  Play the best hockey you can.  Your best way forward here is to enhance your trade value and enhance your value as a UFA.  You’re not going to do that staying off ice.  It didn’t work for Jonathan Drouin, it’s not going to work for you.

Posted by BarryKlob on 09/25/17 at 09:42 AM ET

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My personal opinion is that Blashill and probably KH have a personality clash with you, especially Blashill. He kept your minutes down, and used players who couldn’t score. I feel KH is just trying to get you to sign just to trade you. If you sign for the 3.8 mil get performance clauses put in and make the contract null and void upon a trade. I doubt either one of these idiots can promise anything because I’m not so sure they’ll be around.  I think there are teams interested and KH is trying to get you to sign so he can unload some crap. Only signs left are offer sheet, attendance at LCA and how well the team performs. I don’t know who’s in charge of sports for Ilitch but he’s gutting the Tigers also, bent on destruction. Look at those performers, JD Martinez, Upton, Verlander, unreal. Top line looks good for them but they didn’t lower prices and don’t want to watch them lose anyway.

Posted by stateofmifan on 09/25/17 at 09:45 AM ET

The Meal's avatar

Don’t be redolent.

Posted by The Meal from Longmont, CO on 09/25/17 at 09:47 AM ET

TreKronor's avatar

Get on the ice and prove you belong on this team.  Because right now there’s a few younger kids who are sticking around a little longer than we thought they would.

Posted by TreKronor on 09/25/17 at 09:48 AM ET

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AA, as a Canadian kid, I am sure it’s been your dream to play in the NHL. Maybe when you were a teenager, you even said “I will give anything to play in the NHL”. Now you will be paid millions of dollars and you will be playing in NHL. Did you really dream of playing for AK Bars Kazan when you were a child? I totally understand you think you should be making more money than Glen and Sheahan or maybe even Abby and Helm. I get that and you might be right, but you’ve been in the league for a short time. Take these 2 years to improve your game and to show KH and Blashill that you are worth a lot more than $1.9 mil. Work hard, develop your skills and you are going to get paid handsomely and will be a multimillionaire when you finish your career. 10 years from now, you will not even remember this money difference. I understand you do not like Blashill as a coach, but there are 30 coaches in NHL and chances are you are not going to like many of them. So, at this point, tell your agent to sign the contract and use valuable time to get ready for the season. Red Wings are not in a great shape, but this is a proud franchise with the loyal fans all over the world. Again, you are playing for the Red Wings and in NHL and making $2 mil per year and you are 23. Life is good.

Posted by VPalmer on 09/25/17 at 09:51 AM ET

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Can we have a similar article where we offer advice to Kenny? Would that break the internet?

Posted by fatsavage on 09/25/17 at 09:54 AM ET

The Meal's avatar

In all seriousness…  I understand the idea behind going for the biggest dollars while you can.  You’re a professional athlete and your career is guaranteed to be shorter than everyone else on here giving you advice.  We have different goals than you do (we want to see quality hockey this year; you want to maximize your career).  However…

If you leave now, you’re permanently branded for the life of your career.  You’re the Canadian Alexander Radulov.  You’re forever the guy who chased the dollar sign.  It’s almost guaranteed that your career will be spent playing for 3+ teams (if everything shakes out for you), and you’ll never be part of The Family™ with any one given team.  (I.e., no Abdelkader or Helm contracts for you going into the second half of your career.)  Now I know being in The Family isn’t what everyone wants out of their career (I even spoke to one of your teammates about exactly this last February), so if you’re looking to catalog lots of different experiences, then you can’t get much more off the beaten path than a season or two in the KHL.  (And then a tour across the NHL a la Jason Williams to follow.)

But, there’s something to be said for being in The Family.  Folks buy your jersey.  Folks buy you beers.  Folks hang on your every move, every tweet, every sneeze.  You become idolized (and right now, our Family is not filled with possible folks to be idolized, so there’s a real opportunity for you here).  You bring the Cup back home one summer, and there are folks from The Family who want to come and be involved.  If you’re a team bouncer, you’re never The Hero, The Man, or The Captain (or The Perfect Human).  You’re an added piece.  (Ever wonder how much better known Jagr would be if he stayed with the Pens for all those years?  It wouldn’t be a boo-hoo old-timer can’t find a job at the end of his forever career.  There’d be talk of 31 other teams having a farewell to Jaromir night every time the Pens came into town.)

You know your situation and what you want (though leaving a KHL contract on the table for 3 weeks and running seems to show us what you want as well).  If you want to stick around and be part of The Family, get yourself a beefy insurance policy (paying you in perpetuity for years and years in case something happens), take this smaller contract, and embrace the celebrity of playing in the one city which is all at the same time Hockeytown, and the place where the media leaves you alone and the fans simultaneously love you and leave you to be your own damn self.  This is playing the long game, and it basically guarantees you long-term success.

Posted by The Meal from Longmont, CO on 09/25/17 at 10:03 AM ET

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Sorry. I disagree that going to the KHL will black-ball him. Please explain Mark Giordano. A Canadian kid playing in a Canadian city, but disgruntled with ice-time.

He bolted for the KHL. Made more money. Got lots of playing time. Came back a better player. No hard feelings from the organization. Became a valuable member of the team. Got paid. By the end of his curretn deal he will have made over $60M from the organization that he “abandoned”. Became team Captain. Played in Olympics/World Cup for Canada. Has had some Norris votes. He didn’t get black-balled.

Jir Hudler left to the KHL. Made a pile of cash there. Had a great season there. Came back and honoured his contract. Then as a UFA received a pretty lucrative $4M x 4 year deal. So in the 7 years since he returned from the KHL, Hudler has earned almost $24,000,000. So leaving for the KHL didn’t ruin his career, nor ruin him financially.

Posted by fatsavage on 09/25/17 at 10:15 AM ET

OlderThanChelios's avatar

AA doesn’t need advice. But Ken Holland sure needs it by the truckload.

Posted by Nathan from the scoresheet!

What Nathan said because offering AA $100k more than what Glendenning makes is beyond insulting.

However, barring Ken Holland being overcome by a sudden surge of intelligence, sign the damn contract. Then screw the Wings for every fricking penny you can once you have arbitration rights.

And when you reach free agency, if Holland and Company are still around, sign with a team that actually values you – even if it’s for a few dollars less than what the Wings offer you.

Posted by OlderThanChelios from Grand Rapids, MI on 09/25/17 at 10:20 AM ET

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You’re one of the most exciting players to come to Detroit since Z and Pavel. You, Dylan and Anthony could be hockey’s next big 3. But it’s about the good of the team. When Nick Lidstrom was here, no one took more money than Nick for the good of the team and respect. I love your game kid but you’re breaking Red Wing Nation’s heart by not signing. Get to camp, you’ll get your money.

Posted by icepick19 on 09/25/17 at 10:31 AM ET

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go to the K.

don’t let lifting all those rubles lead to a “swedish” injury.

when you return to the NHL, as FS pointed out with Giordano, you will will be a good player when you reach your 30s. I can’t wait for 2024 now.

Posted by howeandhowe from Seattle on 09/25/17 at 10:52 AM ET

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when you return to the NHL, as FS pointed out with Giordano, you will will be a good player when you reach your 30s. I can’t wait for 2024 now.

Posted by howeandhowe from Seattle on 09/25/17 at 11:52 AM ET

Giordano returned to the NHL at age 25 and made an immediate impact. By age 26 he was part of a very solid top 4 that include Phaneuf, Bouwmeester and Regehr. He was playing 20+ minutes a night with that group at age 26. He looked so promising that in the next year, the Flames traded Phaneuf and gave Giordano a $4M x 5 year contract extension. That was age 27. He was also representing Canada in the World Cup at that time.

But sure. let’s go with your uninformed story about not becoming a good player until your 30’s…

Posted by fatsavage on 09/25/17 at 11:09 AM ET

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  Can we have a similar article where we offer advice to Kenny? Would that break the internet?

Posted by fatsavage on 09/25/17 at 10:54 AM ET

Did Kenny not sign his ‘83 Upper Deck card for you as a kid?

Posted by benzanato on 09/25/17 at 11:28 AM ET

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But sure. let’s go with your uninformed story about not becoming a good player until your 30’s…

awe shucks. I sure hate is when people disagree with me.

Came back a better player.

2006-07 Calgary Flames NHL   48 7 8 15 36
2006-07 Omaha Ak-Sar-Ben AHL     5 0 2   2   8
2007-08 Moscow Dynamo Russia 50 4 9 13 89  
2008-09 Calgary Flames NHL     58 2 17 19 59

Looks to me like he came back the same player.

He was also representing Canada in the World Cup at that time.

not really the best that Canada had to offer.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_IIHF_World_Championship_rosters#Canada

Posted by howeandhowe from Seattle on 09/25/17 at 11:38 AM ET

DocF's avatar

Murray Chadwick said it very well, indeed.

Posted by DocF from Now: Lynn Haven, FL; was Reidsville, NC on 09/25/17 at 11:44 AM ET

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2006-07 Calgary Flames NHL   48 7 8 15 36
2006-07 Omaha Ak-Sar-Ben AHL   5 0 2   2   8
2007-08 Moscow Dynamo Russia 50 4 9 13 89  
2008-09 Calgary Flames NHL   58 2 17 19 59

Looks to me like he came back the same player.

He was also representing Canada in the World Cup at that time.

not really the best that Canada had to offer.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_IIHF_World_Championship_rosters#Canada

Posted by howeandhowe from Seattle on 09/25/17 at 12:38 PM ET

Haha. Keep digging your hole. Maybe you’ll get to Russia?

So you are comparing Giordano’s 2006-07 season and his 2008-09 based on points I guess? No mention that his ice-time went up almost 3 minutes per game? His shots on goal increased by almost 40% per game. His possession metrics increased. His coaches raved about how he returned as a different player. His season-ending injury in 2008-2009 was cited as a big blow to their playoff hopes. Yeah leave that stuff out and just do a cut and paste of some stats without any context.

But hey, why not hear from Giordano himself on this…

The jump to Russia was not popular among the Flames brass, but Giordano made the move to further his career in the manner he saw fit.

“I don’t think it hurt me development-wise,” he says. “If anything, it made me a better player. I played a lot of minutes over there and got a lot of ice time. It worked out in the end, that’s all anybody can really say. (well except apparently howeandhowe)

“It could have gone the other way, but it didn’t.”

North American players don’t generally hold up their hands and volunteer to play in Russia, but Giordano didn’t hesitate. “It’s not like you’re in a Rocky movie where you’re a cabin in the middle of nowhere,” he says. “I didn’t have a problem with Russia. I was living in a big city. It felt like any other big city. It just that the language barrier was tough. It was tough to do everyday things like banking and groceries and all that.

Building on his KHL experience, Giordano signed a three-year deal with the Flames. He broke out last season with career highs of 11 goals, 30 points and led the team with a plus-17 rating.

Posted by fatsavage on 09/25/17 at 12:00 PM ET

ilovehomers's avatar

If you have a problem with restricted free agency and the rights that you have as a player, take it up with the Player’s Association.

Good luck winning that battle.

Sign the contract and play good soldier. Don’t let Frk pass you on the depth chart.

Posted by ilovehomers on 09/25/17 at 12:09 PM ET

damndog's avatar

Yes AA, sign the contract for 1.9m/two seasons and hope Blasholland do not keep you buried on the 4th line so when your next contract comes around they say ” but you played fourth line minutes and this is our pay structure for this type of player…”

AA’s agent is a complete knucklehead, that is obvious. Trying to make a name for himself. AA should dump his ass at once to help clear the air. Holland starting out at 1.2/for one season was asinine to begin with should bounce up his offer to at least 2.1m/season to extend an olive branch.

 

Posted by damndog from The Eastside of Detroit on 09/25/17 at 12:12 PM ET

Steve in San Francisco's avatar

Sign the one year deal, tear it up this year, and go to the negotiating table with arbitration rights next summer. Altho, to me, it would also be hard to turn down being a stud with Team Canada at the Olympics, despite the fact that they wouldn’t be favourites this time round.

Posted by Steve in San Francisco on 09/25/17 at 12:25 PM ET

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Sign the one year deal, tear it up this year, and go to the negotiating table with arbitration rights next summer.

This!

If you think you’re worth a lot more than the Wings are offering then sign the one-year deal and when you have arbitration rights next year you make them pay and you make it hurt.

Posted by CharDeeMacDennis on 09/25/17 at 12:30 PM ET

MurrayChadwick's avatar

AA’s agent is a complete knucklehead, that is obvious. Trying to make a name for himself. AA should dump his ass at once to help clear the air. Holland starting out at 1.2/for one season was asinine to begin with should bounce up his offer to at least 2.1m/season to extend an olive branch.

Posted by damndog from The Eastside of Detroit on 09/25/17 at 01:12 PM ET

IMO, AA’s agent did his job to perfection until this past week, and what we don’t know is whether he’s told AA to sign or wait, and if AA is bucking him or following him.

Posted by MurrayChadwick from Holland Hate Hyperbole Town (HHHT) on 09/25/17 at 01:40 PM ET

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No mention that his ice-time went up almost 3 minutes per game? His shots on goal increased by almost 40% per game. His possession metrics increased.

gee wiz. all that and he only managed about the same amount of points as when he left?
Meanwhile, wasn’t your point about he came back a better player? it appears he left a 3rd pairing guy and returned a 3rd pairing guy. His time increase (and all other stats) probably would have happened had he not gone to the K. He averaged 13 minutes. The only way he would have gone down was being demoted. Let’s also look at the fact that he only had to beat out Anders Eriksson to play on the 2nd line when he went to the K.
https://www.hockey-reference.com/teams/CGY/2007.html
https://www.hockey-reference.com/teams/CGY/2008.html
https://www.hockey-reference.com/teams/CGY/2009.html

but hey, I am looking as such a small sample of information while you are merely using one player to illustrate how AA will be just fine going to the K.

North American players don’t generally hold up their hands and volunteer to play in Russia
yet, almost 300 have.

http://www.quanthockey.com/khl/nationality/american-khl-players-career-stats.html - 84 Americans
http://www.quanthockey.com/khl/nationality/canadian-khl-players-career-stats.html - 211 Canadians

do a cut and paste…without any context.

You mean like drawings conclusions about AA based on the experience of just one person out of 295? I seem to recall you condemning other people for using small sample sizes. just 1 of 295 is a pretty small sample size to be drawing conclusions from.

His coaches raved about how he returned as a different player.

conjecture without actual quotes. but hey, I was only able to drum up copying and pasting some stats…..you’ve done so much more…....oh, sorry, you don’t like that word, conjecture, maybe I should use one that you will find in your safe space….surmise. let’s go with that.

While you want to argue about whether Giordano is a good player or not, I’d rather point to the fact using him as what will happen to AA is missing out on a whole bunch of other Data.

“It could have gone the other way, but it didn’t.”
- Mark Giordano.

Lucky for him. It speaks a lot about his character to phrase his experience in the K that way. I wonder if that’s how AA see’s it….....

Posted by howeandhowe from Seattle on 09/25/17 at 01:40 PM ET

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IMO, AA’s agent did his job to perfection until this past week, and what we don’t know is whether he’s told AA to sign or wait, and if AA is bucking him or following him.

Posted by MurrayChadwick from Holland Hate Hyperbole Town (HHHT) on 09/25/17 at 02:40 PM ET

It’s not like AA or his agent had a bunch of strategies in front of them to choose from. I would wager they did exactly as KH expected.

Posted by howeandhowe from Seattle on 09/25/17 at 01:42 PM ET

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Many of those 295 players that go to the KHL are guys on their last legs trying to keep their career alive - see David Booth.

I never claimed going to the KHL was the right move for these 295 players. Nor did I claim it was the right move for AA. In fact, you’ll notice that I suggested to sign an NHL contract and quietly ask for a trade.

I simply refuted the point that going to the KHL would result in being black-balled and would be harmful to your career. It might. But I provided examples of players who it turned out very good for them - Giordano and Hudler.

Then you came along and made reference to Giordano becoming a “good” player after age 30. Which is 100% wrong. Sorry. Go on any neutral fansite and try to argue that after Giordano returned from the KHL at age 25…he didn’t become “good” until after age 30. Good luck arguing that. Use lots of stats if you like. Use the $20M contract he signed in his 20’s. Have fun.

Posted by fatsavage on 09/25/17 at 01:49 PM ET

MurrayChadwick's avatar

Posted by howeandhowe from Seattle on 09/25/17 at 02:42 PM ET

Agreed to an extent, he’s limited as an RFA, thems the rules, and he’s Canadian, he wasn’t going to Russia, Holland has the trump card, always has.  But there’s also tons of RFAs each and every season, and AA’s agents went out and got a KHL offer to push negotiations, that’s not happening all the time. 

Many here in HHHT say that Holland offered only an insulting one deal, and it was the KHL offer that goosed it up.  Now obviously we know that’s a flat out lie, a made up excuse to bash Holland (as if additional reasons need to be made up), but never the less, I do think the KHL offer goosed up the contract offerS KH offered AA.

 

Posted by MurrayChadwick from Holland Hate Hyperbole Town (HHHT) on 09/25/17 at 02:32 PM ET

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Many here in HHHT say that Holland offered only an insulting one deal, and it was the KHL offer that goosed it up.  Now obviously we know that’s a flat out lie

And we know this how? I’ve heard only one report from HSJ that KH offered a one year $1.25 deal and when AA threatened to go to Russia, KH increased the offer to 2 years at $1.9 mil.
We’ve also heard from you that KH made different offers from day one. Very possible. But as far as I know we are still not aware of what those offers were. Maybe 1 year at $1.25 and 2 years at $1.35. So, I would like you to have a proof that KH indeed offered something very close to $1.9 per year (at the same time he offered $1.25 deal that was reported) before making these statements about a flat out lie.

Posted by VPalmer on 09/25/17 at 03:09 PM ET

Avatar

Have fun.

that’s why I pick on you. it is fun. wink

Posted by howeandhowe from Seattle on 09/25/17 at 03:12 PM ET

damndog's avatar

“IMO, AA’s agent did his job to perfection”

Hey Murray, can you expand on this thought of yours? I don’t want to fill in the blanks. Seriously interested in your take on this.

Posted by damndog from The Eastside of Detroit on 09/25/17 at 03:20 PM ET

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The Malik Report is a destination for all things Red Wings-related. I offer biased, perhaps unprofessional-at-times and verbose coverage of my favorite team, their prospects and developmental affiliates. I've joined the Kukla's Korner family with five years of blogging under my belt, and I hope you'll find almost everything you need to follow your Red Wings at a place where all opinions are created equal and we're all friends, talking about hockey and the team we love to follow.

 

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