Kukla's Korner

The Malik Report

Red Wings overnight report: the Daniel Cleary fandango resumes

Warning, warning, this entry contains a clearly-visible swear word!

This morning's entry took a bit of a turn when Capgeek Tweeted that it had new Red Wings contract info, so I headed over to their Red Wings salary cap chart, and of course Daniel Cleary's 1-year, $1.5 million contract now includes:

1. A base salary of $1.5 million (with a one-way salary; he'll make his $ regardless of whether he's in the NHL or AHL);

2. A $1 million performance bonus for 10 games played (which might be deferred to the 2015-2016 salary cap);

3. A no-trade clause;

4. And a $250,000 signing bonus. Because, y'know, promises and what-not. Happy summer!

Anyway...I was going to start by saying that Red Wings fans have long had a love-hate relationship with Cleary, mostly involving love during his productive years on the team, and a significant amount of anger, resentment and bitterness about the team bringing back Cleary last fall at the expense of one Gustav Nyquist's 2013-2014 season beginning in Grand Rapids (please also see: 28 goals, 20 assists and 48 points in 57 games played after Nyquist was recalled from Grand Rapids in late December)...

And then enduring a season in which Cleary was mostly "broken" due to groin and knee injuries, only to witness Cleary re-signed on July 10th because the team apparently promised to "take care of him" for either turning down a reported 3-year contract in the $7.5-to-$9.5 million range from Philadelphia and/or what may or may not have turned out to be a pro try-out contract instead. 

Those of us who've made our dissent known regarding the concept that Cleary might win a roster spot over the likes of Tomas Jurco (the Wings' only waiver-exempt forward), the now-now-longer-waiver-exempt Landon Ferraro or Mitch Callahan, or even the spare part that is Joakim Andersson or the player that Wings fans insist is a borderline NHL'er at best in Luke Glendening...

We're upset. We're pissed off. We don't like the concept of Jurco getting Nyquist'd, Ferraro or Callahan waived even if they play better than Cleary does during training camp or the exhibition season, and we don't like the seeming inevitability that is Cleary simply winning a roster battle

Perhaps we're a bit bitter because we witnessed Mike Babcock and Ken Holland slowly evolve from holding, "Veterans win roster spots by default in October" and, "The kids aren't the answer" philosophies to find that the coach and GM actually embraced the concept that the "kids" might in fact be the key to making the playoffs, and making roster decisions accordingly, and then we watched the Wings swing and miss in free agency...

Only to make what appear to be both reactionary, expensive and lateral re-signings in the form of Cleary and Kyle Quincey, who parlayed a season in which he posted 13 points in 82 games and only finished at -5 after spending the most of the season hovering somewhere between -13 and -9 into a half-million-dollar-a-year raise and 2 more years of this...

And possibly 2 more years of this, given that our faith in the coaching and management staffs has been shattered:

FUN TIMES!

Of course, along the way, we've been told that Ken Holland doesn't care what we think and that Daniel Cleary doesn't care what people on social media think.

Of course, the intonation that people on the interweb daring to have an opinion is dreadful because people who share their opinions on social media are all trolls who live under the same damn bridge, and we can't possibly understand that Cleary posting 8 points and finishing at -11 in 54 games played is totally not a reflection on his performance (though even Luke Glendening and his depleted uranium hands finished 1 point behind Cleary) or that Cleary having posted 23 points and finishing at a total of -16 over the past 2 seasons (Nyquist and Tomas Tatar out-scored Cleary's past-two-seasons performance during last year alone; Riley Sheahan equaled it in 42 games played, and Tomas Jurco's 15 points were registered over the course of 36 games played; don't even ask about Cleary's "fancy stats," because they're terrible).

I mean, shit, man, we're having the annual summertime, "The comments section is a zoo: do we kill it with fire?" discussion here on TMR, but I do in fact value the opinions everyone posits here. Not everybody is a troll, and the delicate suggestion-within-a-suggestion that Wings fans are somehow misinformed, if not a bunch of idiots, for daring to dislike Cleary's return is a bit insulting.

Cleary spoke with the Detroit News's Ted Kulfan on Tuesday evening, and Kulfan reports that Cleary's "Motivated by Red Wings fans' disapproval of his return":

Daniel Cleary doesn’t live on social media. And that might be a good thing. Since last week, social media have been ablaze with fans dumbfounded by the Red Wings re-signing the forward to a one-year contract worth $1.5 million (with the potential for $1 million in bonuses).

“That’s just the way it is these days,” Cleary said. “There are going to be opinions on everything. You can’t let it affect you, and I don’t. People are going to say whatever they want, and especially about pro sports. You can’t let it get to you.”

Cleary doesn’t. But don’t think for a second it doesn’t add a bit more fuel to Cleary’s offseason workouts as he hopes to rebound from a disappointing season (eight points, four goals, 52 games) cut short by a knee injury.

“You want to prove people wrong,” said Cleary, who is working with Plymouth-based trainer Mike Barwis. “My main objective is get healthy and play the way I know I can. Last year was a tough year.”

Again, we're being told that Cleary may in fact not "earn" a spot on the roster, especially if Daniel Alfredsson (see: tied for the team lead in scoring) returns...

“But that’s always the way it is, there’s always competition,” Cleary said. “Mike has always been consistent about that, about using who is playing well. Nothing will change.”

And the General Manager insists that the man who had a bad reaction to an injection of synthetic knee lubricant designed to buy time for people with bad osteoarthris in their knees (Cleary's knee issues are degenerative in nature) is going to rebound:

“He’s a player the coaches and his teammates like, and wanted him back,” Holland said. “He’s one of the leaders.”

...

“Dan had a tough season,” Holland said. “But he’s working hard, and we’re hopeful he’ll bounce back.”

All I can say is this: when a pal on Twitter posted a Daniel Cleary "banner," I had a hard time not responding with a Late Night Art With George's MS Paint-edited version:

 

 

 

In cheerier overseas news, Pavel Datsyuk's summer hockey school is underway in the Moscow suburb of Zelenograd, and Red Wings Grinder/Championat's Alexey Kovalevich will be among the media members taking part in a Datsyuk and hockey coaches vs. the media game today.

Datsyuk posted several Tweets regarding his mid-summer summit, now sponsored by the Russian cell phone company Megafon...

(I know that Sharks assistant coach Jay Woodcroft takes part in the school)

Allhockey.ru's Alexander Shapiro also posted some pictures from the camp:

Pictures courtesy of Allhockey.ru's Alexander Shapiro

 

 

 

In news regarding lists and Wings competition: The Free Press's Brian Manzullo reports that two Michigan coaches made the Sporting News's "Top 25"...

The state of Michigan landed two coaches in the Sporting News’ top 25 active coaches among the six major sports (NFL, MLB, NBA, NHL, college football, college hoops).

Michigan State basketball coach Tom Izzo ranks No. 11. Detroit Red Wings coach Mike Babcock is just behind him at No. 13.

Quoting the Sporting News:

13. Mike Babcock

Championships: Babcock led the Detroit Red Wings to the Stanley Cup championship in 2008.

Why he's here: "Babcock has more wins with the Red Wings than Jack Adams, but no Jack Adams Award. It's a weird bit of irony for one of hockey's best-regarded coaches. Last season, he presided over an impressive youth movement, and next season, should he move on, he's going to make a dump-truck's worth of money. If an NHL coach deserves it, it’s him." — Sean Gentille

Stat that matters: Babcock is big in the international game. He led Canada to the gold medals in the 2010 and 2014 Winter Olympics.

(I have this theory that Babcock's having a blast with the media speculation that he's going to "move on" despite his public statements to the contrary, and I'd imagine that he might use his leverage to double his $2 million annual salary, but that's just me)

SI's Allan Muir reports that the Wings did not fare so well in Forbes' annual ranking (they seem to rank everything under the sun) of sports' 50 most valuable franchises; only the Toronto Maple Leafs made the list as a $1.15-billion organization, but no other NHL team made the list (Forbes' NHL valuations, compiled last November, estimated the Wings' value at $470 million, and you can assume that the follow-on rink, now scheduled to open two years from now, will increase that number substantially);

 

 

 

 

In "checking out the competition" chatter, the Free Press's Helene St. James continues her assessments of the Wings Altantic Division rivals' off-season moves by surveying the Montreal Canadiens today. The Habs may have made the Eastern Conference Final, but they made some...unique...changes...

The Canadiens lost captain Brian Gionta and Thomas Vanek via free agency, and traded Josh Gorges and Danny Briere. Replenishment has taken the form of face-off master Manny Malhotra and defenseman Tom Gilbert, who joins his third team in three seasons. P.A. Parenteau was acquired for Briere. Gorges yielded a second-round pick.

Offensive defenseman P.K. Subban, a restricted free agent, remains unsigned.

Subban's currently scheduled to have a salary arbitration hearing on August 1st...

Swapping Parenteau for Briere looks good in light of the age difference between them — Parenteau is 31 and Briere is soon to be 37. Montreal took a chance on Vanek at the trade deadline, but he was a playoff disappointment, so it’s no surprise he isn’t returning.

The Canadiens are headlined by Carey Price, the elite goaltender whose 2014 was highlighted by an Olympic gold medal with Canada. Price left the playoffs in the third round after being injured in the first game against the Rangers, a loss the Habs couldn’t overcome.

The Canadiens are a middling team offensively, and Price is a big reason behind their top-10 finish defensively last season. They haven’t improved their scoring capability, and as a group Montreal’s defensemen don’t stack up to Boston’s or Tampa Bay’s.

 

 

 

In prospect news--July-style--JuniorHockey.com's Bliss Littler penned a profile of Wings 2014 draft pick Chase Perry...

A year ago in early June Chase Perry a 96 born goalie was given the news that he did not want to hear. The Sioux Falls Stampede of the USHL would not have room for him after he attended their main camp. A week later the Wenatchee Wild drafted Chase on a flyer that he would leave his Minnesota high school team and come west to Wenatchee, Washington and play in the NAHL for the Wild.

Chase was recruited to come out to the Wild's main camp in July. Chase played well in the camp but not well enough to earn a spot on the Wild. We wanted to see more so we invited Chase along with two other goalies from the Wild's camp to attend a second camp held in Minnesota at no charge. We felt we had a NAHL veteran in goal coming in from Sweden in Gustof Johanson to be the starter but we needed a quality younger goalie to come in and back up. It should also be noted that Gustof would not be able to play until the end of October because of an injury. The backup would have a great opportunity to play a lot the first two months. Chase came to the second camp and narrowly beat out the other goalies. Chase had a spot with the Wild for the 2013-2014 season.

Chase came to Wenatchee with the promise that we would get him in a minimum of 15 games. He would have to earn anything else. What Chase did with this opportunity was show up to Wenatchee with a great attitude, a super work ethic, and team first mentality. What Chase left with 13 months later was team MVP, probably the most respected person on the team, many friendships that will last a lifetime, a scholarship to Colorado College for this upcoming season and to top it off Chase was selected by the Detroit Red Wings in the fifth round of this year's NHL draft.

And Ryan Sproul watched his pal Peter Holland make quite the shot after signing a 2-year contract with Toronto:

Here's hoping that Sproul finds himself in a similar situation two summers from now.

 

 

 

Otherwise...If you're into Green Slime, per the Free Press's Steve Schrader:

Justin Verlander is up for the Biggest Cannon award at the first Kids’ Choice Sports Awards, hosted by Michael Strahan at 8 tonight on Nickelodeon. Our other local nominees are Calvin Johnson for Favorite Catch, and Red Wings fans for Smells Like Team Spirit.

The Metro Times' Ryan Felton broke down the construction of the M-1 Rail line on Woodward (the planned stop on Sibley Street = right across from the Wings' follow-on rink)...

As a reminder, the Ted Lindsay Foundation is bringing HockeyFest to the Kroger in Canton, MI this Saturday...


And finally, in anticipation of the fun we're going to have in the comments section today, once again, we're trying to come up with ideas as to how to improve the inclusiveness of said comments section. Please share your opinions regarding what we can do to build up the TMR community in the comments section, on Twitter, Facebook or via email. The goal here remainsenlightened improving the community enlightened as opposed to being punitive for the sake of being punitive.

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Comments

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w2j2's avatar

IMHO, The Cleary and Quincy issues have been discussed ad nauseum.
I realize that sundry journalists, over time, will need something to write about and dig this up.
The 19 of us have had our say and should let it rest.
cool smirk

Posted by w2j2 on 07/17/14 at 07:45 AM ET

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At this point I’m simply tired of Cleary talk. I am actually starting to think that he is going to get buried in the minors and this contract was just a way to give the guy a couple mil.
All I hope for is guys stay healthy next season.

Posted by George0211 on 07/17/14 at 07:53 AM ET

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Agree. Lets bury the Q and Cleary talk. We have a ton of prospects I want to talk about. The future looks bright.

Posted by lancer on 07/17/14 at 08:14 AM ET

Nathan's avatar

The Quincey re-signing is actually fine given striking out elsewhere. They do need a player like that and for all the complaints we can put out there about Q, he’s being paid what the market will bear, because generally functional defensemen are paid like crazy more often than not.

Yes, the horse has been beaten, but I don’t understand why they didn’t find another way to make good on the promise to Cleary, financially speaking. Make him an “adviser” after retirement or something. Have him work 10 hour weeks “scouting.” Whatever. It was a bad decision, that is plain to see.

Posted by Nathan from the scoresheet! on 07/17/14 at 08:37 AM ET

Kate from Pa.-made in Detroit's avatar

Yes, the horse has been beaten

The horse is dead. wink

Lets Go Red Wings!!!!!

Posted by Kate from Pa.-made in Detroit on 07/17/14 at 09:56 AM ET

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Cleary aside, our situation for forward slots 10 through 14 is unsettled and, in my opinion, pretty interesting.

I think the “top nine” are probably Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Franzen, Nyquist, Weiss, Tatar, Sheahan, Abdelkader, and Jurco.  Alfie or Mantha could bump Jurco to the AHL or Abdelkader to the “bottom five”, but let’s assume that doesn’t happen.

That leaves 5 spots for

Helm
Glendening
Miller
Andersson
Cleary
Ferraro
Callahan

I think that’s a pretty interesting competition, because the only absolute, play-him-every-night, locks-down-a-role, worthy-of-mention-alongside-the-Grind-Line guy is Helm.  Andersson and Glendening are superficially similar—defensive centers who aren’t great skaters or great at faceoffs, but are good on the PK and at least somewhat physical.  Miller is by default the top PKing wing and easily slots into that fourth line, but he’s not really a special player.  Cleary used to be an effective guy in a fourth-line kind of role, but at this point might be best as a 13th or 14th forward—his speed seems to be gone and without it he can’t create offense in transition, which is important if you’re skating alongside Helm.  I don’t know what to think about Ferraro or Callahan.

Posted by captaineclectic on 07/17/14 at 09:59 AM ET

SK77's avatar

Talk about bait and switch! Chastise us for the comments being unprofessional, then write yet another ... aaahhh, fuchit.

Posted by SK77 on 07/17/14 at 10:05 AM ET

Wings_in_NYC's avatar

NTC doesn’t even matter. They couldn’t move Cleary if they wanted to. Yeah, this subject is nauseating.

Posted by Wings_in_NYC on 07/17/14 at 10:09 AM ET

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Posted by captaineclectic on 07/17/14 at 09:59 AM ET

IMO, Helm and Miller are definites. After that, who knows. Whatever Babcock feels like.
Probably Cleary will be in at least for the 1st few games (10?) And Babock seems to like Glendening.

Posted by George0211 on 07/17/14 at 10:10 AM ET

MurrayChadwick's avatar

Andersson and Glendening are superficially similar—defensive centers who aren’t great skaters or great at faceoffs, but are good on the PK and at least somewhat physical. 
Posted by captaineclectic

Glenny is actually a pretty fast skater, like just behind Helm in terms of speed, which is why he bumped Anderson out of his roster spot.

Posted by MurrayChadwick on 07/17/14 at 10:18 AM ET

SK77's avatar

IMO, Helm and Miller are definites. After that, who knows. Whatever Babcock feels like.
Probably Cleary will be in at least for the 1st few games (10?) And Babock seems to like Glendening.

Posted by George0211 on 07/17/14 at 10:10 AM ET

Agree on Helm & Miller. Babcock does have a big ol’ Glenny crush as well.

These lists of available players also don’t take into account the Wings being made of porcelain, so maybe it’d be more wise to come up with a list of first 5 AHL call ups LOL

Posted by SK77 on 07/17/14 at 10:18 AM ET

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These lists of available players also don’t take into account the Wings being made of porcelain, so maybe it’d be more wise to come up with a list of first 5 AHL call ups

Posted by SK77 on 07/17/14 at 10:18 AM ET

LOL. You’re right, half these guys are going to be on the shelf before the season even starts.

Posted by George0211 on 07/17/14 at 10:21 AM ET

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They do need a player like that

Like what?

Mediocre, doesn’t put up many points, is very, very, very inconsistent defensively?

Yeah, the Wings were really missing that…

he’s being paid what the market will bear

Well, he’s being paid what a panicked GM was willing to pay after whiffing on the top prizes and apparently not even giving thought to the right-handed puck moving defenseman that apparently wanted to play in Detroit.

Posted by Garth on 07/17/14 at 10:27 AM ET

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I’ve never really noticed Glendening’s speed but maybe it’s the conservative game he plays.

I don’t have a problem with him either on the roster or on the fourth line. I do think a fourth line of Miller, Helm, and Glendening is a little weak overall (at least five on five—they’re all good penalty killers). Not much offensive upside other than Helm, not very physical overall, no one who excels at drawing penalties. It’d be nice to have a spark plug on that line. 2011 Dan Cleary would be a good candidate for the job and maybe even 2014 Justin Abdelkader.

Maybe Glendening will find another gear. He’s done it every other time he’s been doubted.

Posted by captaineclectic on 07/17/14 at 10:36 AM ET

SK77's avatar

Maybe Glendening will find another gear. He’s done it every other time he’s been doubted.

Posted by captaineclectic on 07/17/14 at 10:36 AM ET

I would argue than Glendening is the sandpaper to that theoretical line. He excels at getting under the skin of opponents, something that I don’t think Abdelkader actually does. Probably something to do with that big fuchin’ grin of his.

Posted by SK77 on 07/17/14 at 10:45 AM ET

awould's avatar

2. A $1 million performance bonus for 10 games played (which might be deferred to the 2015-2016 salary cap);

Does this actually mean he gets a cool million dollars if he manages to play 10 games? Roughly 1/8 of the season?

I don’t know if that’s an indictment of his injured body or the chances of him making the roster. Hopefully the second.

Posted by awould on 07/17/14 at 11:18 AM ET

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the delicate suggestion-within-a-suggestion that Wings fans are somehow misinformed, if not a bunch of idiots, for daring to dislike Cleary’s return is a bit insulting.

That’s a fairly deliberate misrepresentation of anything I’ve either read or said with regards to the reaction to the Cleary deal.

If it were, as George attempts to portray, merely ‘disliking’ the signing… no biggie.

That is, obviously, not an accurate representation of the reaction which really took place.  What really took place was sackcloth and ashes donning then standing in the town square and self-immolating outrage, after penning ‘odes’ to the organization to be read upon the guttering of the author ashes.

It’s the wild, ululating overreaction to what is in actuality a tremendously minor signing that elicited my expression of a diminished opinion of the perspicacity of both bloggers and commenters here, which in turn led to the profound affectation of aggrieved anger by those who attach importance to that perception.

Holland moved out or let walk veterans Eaves, Tootoo, Bert, Sammy, Legwand and very possibly Alfredsson at forward… but because he didn’t add Cleary to that list to make it a clean 7 for 7 he is a (insert any of the dozens of pejorative descriptions lobbed his direction recently).

He brought back 1 vet at forward.  Of 7.  And gave him a tiny, 1 year deal that will at maximum amount to less than 1.8% of the teams cap space over the next two years.

APOCALYPSE!!!

Not really.

With regards to Jurco… why does he belong in the top 9?  He was a sub half point guy when up last year and has a very weak defensive game.  He’s unready.  D, Z, Franzen, Weiss, Nyquist, and Tatar (or possibly a late-arriving Alfredsson) are a competent top 6.  Helm, Abdelkader and Sheahan are a competent 3rd.  Miller, Andersson and who cares (Cleary or Glendening or my dead grandmother) are a competent 4th line.  Mantha and Pulkinnen are almost assuredly ahead of Jurco on the forward depth chart at this point, and I’d rather either of them up (barring substantial regression in either) before having Jurco up again next year.

And all of that said, the odds that there are going to be less than 40-50 games in total injuries between those top 6 forwards where Jurco (or whoever) would get called up are too short for me to want to bet against.

 

 

Posted by HockeyinHD on 07/17/14 at 11:20 AM ET

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The only reason Glendonothing is a Babcock favorite, and gets positive press from fans is because he’s a UofM graduate and local boy.  If he was from Boston and went to BC or BU he’d be toiling in the AHL or ECHL.  Total homerism because he’s local.  Too bad Callahan or Ferraro didn’t go to UofM or have Red Berenson bless them somehow, because then they’d have a better chance to make the team.

Posted by bababooey on 07/17/14 at 11:23 AM ET

topshelf14's avatar

It’s going to be an interesting season starting with training camp.  If Holland and Babcock are going to actually follow through on there “the best players will play” comment, then we will have a very competitive camp. 

I was listening to his interview this morning on 105.1 with Rico and Ryan and he said that he is not afraid of sitting some veterans, specifically on defense if the kids that come up are better.  So we’ll see if he and Holland follow through.

This has been repeated but having competition for the 5 and 6 spots on defense would be ideal.  And hopefully get the best out of all of them.  If I had to take a stab at our defense barring injury at the 41 game mark this season it would be this:

Kronwall - Ericcson
Dekeyser - Quincey
Oulett - Marchenko

Something tells me that the Smith experiment is coming to a close and he’ll either be traded for picks or will be our 7th/8th dman.

Posted by topshelf14 from Detroit, MI on 07/17/14 at 11:26 AM ET

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Holland moved out or let walk veterans Eaves, Tootoo, Bert, Sammy, Legwand and very possibly Alfredsson at forward… but because he didn’t add Cleary to that list to make it a clean 7 for 7 he is a (insert any of the dozens of pejorative descriptions lobbed his direction recently).

He brought back 1 vet at forward.  Of 7.  And gave him a tiny, 1 year deal that will at maximum amount to less than 1.8% of the teams cap space over the next two years.

Disaster signings, who made the mistake of even bringing them here?  And instead of trying to rectify the mistakes, we have to wait until their contracts run out to get rid of them.  You give Holland credit for letting them walk?  That’s like giving an arsonist credit for calling the Fire Department

Posted by bababooey on 07/17/14 at 11:26 AM ET

awould's avatar

That’s a fairly deliberate misrepresentation of anything I’ve either read or said with regards to the reaction to the Cleary deal.

You’re actually not the best person to judge whether this depiction applies to you. It does.

Posted by awould on 07/17/14 at 11:27 AM ET

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in what universe is pulkinnen ahead of jurco?

what are you smoking?

Posted by incompetent GM on 07/17/14 at 11:27 AM ET

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Something tells me that the Smith experiment is coming to a close and he’ll either be traded for picks or will be our 7th/8th dman.

Posted by topshelf14 from Detroit, MI on 07/17/14 at 11:26 AM ET

I don’t think that will happen in the beginning. They will most definitely let him play decent number of minutes in the 1st part of the season.

Posted by George0211 on 07/17/14 at 11:28 AM ET

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was listening to his interview this morning on 105.1 with Rico and Ryan and he said that he is not afraid of sitting some veterans, specifically on defense if the kids that come up are better.  So we’ll see if he and Holland follow through.

Most fans will have to see it to believe it.

Something tells me that the Smith experiment is coming to a close and he’ll either be traded for picks or will be our 7th/8th dman.

Why?  He was our best d-man, if not best player in the Boston series.  I think it’d be a huge mistake to give up on Smith.  Pair him with a Dekeyser or another actual responsible d-man and see what happens.

Posted by bababooey on 07/17/14 at 11:30 AM ET

Avatar

in what universe is pulkinnen ahead of jurco?

what are you smoking?

Not only that, but wasn’t Holland quoted as basically saying that Jurco is NHL bound?

Posted by bababooey on 07/17/14 at 11:31 AM ET

SK77's avatar

Something tells me that the Smith experiment is coming to a close and he’ll either be traded for picks or will be our 7th/8th dman.

Posted by topshelf14 from Detroit, MI on 07/17/14 at 11:26 AM ET

Seems like Smith was actually starting to get it together as the season progressed and the experiment is far from over.

He’s definitely not a Norris candidate, but showed enough to give him a continued chance. Think back just a few short years ago to when The Franchise stuck it out with Ericsson – who now slots in as a capable #2/3 defenseman – while the rest of us were screaming for years to cut his ass.

Posted by SK77 on 07/17/14 at 11:33 AM ET

topshelf14's avatar

Think back just a few short years ago to when The Franchise stuck it out with Ericsson – who now slots in as a capable #2/3 defenseman – while the rest of us were screaming for years to cut his ass.  Posted by SK77 on 07/17/14 at 11:33 AM ET

Good point, and I was on the “I hate Ericsson” bandwagon.  Smith was much more competent when paired with Kronwall.  I guess my last impression of him was when he was ragdolled by Chara and the embarrassment I felt for him.

Here’s to hoping he lives up to that hype he once had.

 

Posted by topshelf14 from Detroit, MI on 07/17/14 at 11:38 AM ET

RWBill's avatar


IMHO, The Cleary and Quincy issues have been discussed ad nauseum.
I realize that sundry journalists, over time, will need something to write about and dig this up.
The 19 of us have had our say and should let it rest.

Posted by w2j2 on 07/17/14 at 07:45 AM ET

Amazingly, or more likely, logically, when I read the headline this was also my first reaction.

There’s little I can add anymore, or anyone can.  I will always pull for the Wings and that necessitates hoping Cleary does well.  Come October 2015, what will have made the Wings a better team, Cleary playing, or Jurco with a complete season under his belt ( substitute Glendening, Sheahan, Tatar, if you prefer ).

Posted by RWBill from cruising Brush Street with creepy Rob Lowe. on 07/17/14 at 11:39 AM ET

calquake's avatar

What really took place was sackcloth and ashes donning then standing in the town square and self-immolating outrage, after penning ‘odes’ to the organization to be read upon the guttering of the author ashes.


Good times… smile

Miller, Andersson and who cares (Cleary or Glendening or my dead grandmother) are a competent 4th line.

I understand she couldn’t skate very well but she used her elbows like Gordie Howe did. cheese

Posted by calquake on 07/17/14 at 11:41 AM ET

Down River Dan's avatar

I remember back when Scotty had just come to town. There was some serious chatter that Scotty was trying to deal Stevie to the Senators. I seem remember opening night that Scotty was booed rather soundly, and he seem to have a big of a smirk on his face while the crowd booed. I’m sure most wouldn’t believe that Wings fans would have ever booed Scotty. Funny how the passage of time changes your recollection of events.

I will will feel badly if Dan is given a similar reception. I’m not a big fan of bringing him back either, but I still wouldn’t boo Dan if given the chance.

Posted by Down River Dan on 07/17/14 at 11:42 AM ET

RWBill's avatar

The only reason Glendonothing is a Babcock favorite, and gets positive press from fans is because he’s a UofM graduate and local boy.  If he was from Boston and went to BC or BU he’d be toiling in the AHL or ECHL.  Total homerism because he’s local.  Too bad Callahan or Ferraro didn’t go to UofM or have Red Berenson bless them somehow, because then they’d have a better chance to make the team.

Posted by bababooey on 07/17/14 at 11:23 AM ET

You’ve missed a lot on that one.

Posted by RWBill from cruising Brush Street with creepy Rob Lowe. on 07/17/14 at 11:45 AM ET

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You’ve missed a lot on that one

He doesn’t win face offs, he doesn’t score to save his life.  His defense is over rated as well, so besides his skating what does he do that deserves a top 12 role on this team other than being a pet of Babcock?

Posted by bababooey on 07/17/14 at 11:48 AM ET

J.J. from Kansas's avatar

Something tells me that the Smith experiment is coming to a close and he’ll either be traded for picks or will be our 7th/8th dman.

What is it that tells you that though? The fact that Babcock was all too happy to pair him with and keep him together with Kronwall when Ericsson went down?

I have no reason to believe that they’ve run out of patience with the 25-year old Brendan Smith, especially after he smoked his way past the 27-year old Jakub Kindl on the depth chart.

I know a lot of people WANT to see two prospects on the bottom pairing, but Smith is a much better defenseman than Ouellet/Sproul/Marchenko and he’s still getting better. Playing Ouellet/Marchenko as a bottom pairing instead of having Smith with one of them makes for a worse third pair than you’d otherwise have.

I’m just wondering if there’s evidence that I haven’t seen which suggests it or if it’s merely something you want to see happen.

Posted by J.J. from Kansas on 07/17/14 at 11:59 AM ET

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I would argue than Glendening is the sandpaper to that theoretical line. He excels at getting under the skin of opponents, something that I don’t think Abdelkader actually does. Probably something to do with that big fuchin’ grin of his.

I know there’s some sandpaper to his game but he’s not a force to be reckoned with.

Stats don’t lie on the pest factor—Abdelkader drew 22 penalties and took 14.  Glendening drew 14 and took 11. 

No doubt part of that is that Abdelkader’s line is sometimes actually playing offense, but as of now he’s the more proven pest.

I will pass without comment over Kyle Quincey’s second-worst-in-the-league -26 penalty ratio.  Hard to be a penalty killing specialist from the box, Kyle.

Posted by captaineclectic on 07/17/14 at 12:21 PM ET

Nathan's avatar

Helm and Miller are guaranteed in the lineup. I don’t see any way they aren’t. And frankly, they should be (unless the team is no better than last year, in which case, both guys should be tradeable assets come the deadline).

Giving up on Brendan Smith would be a goddamn travesty. They have too much invested in him. He’s at a point where he clearly has more value to the Wings than he does to other teams, so I don’t see him fetching anything exciting in the trade market. Look at Smith’s style of play and career trajectory thus far—looks a hell of a lot like Nick Kronwall’s on both counts. I’ll take my chances with that. This year is not so much a “make or break” year, but I believe it will determine if Smith truly has a Kronwall-esque ceiling, and can be counted on to get there, or if he’s something less.

Posted by Nathan from the scoresheet! on 07/17/14 at 01:28 PM ET

OlderThanChelios's avatar

...besides (Glendenning’s) skating what does he do that deserves a top 12 role on this team other than being a pet of Babcock?

Posted by bababooey

From what I saw last year, I think the thing that Luke brings is the ability to play against the opposition’s top ine. When Emnmerton centered the 4th line, Babcock would never consider putting him out there against someone like Crysbaby. But Glendening seems to play him (and other top centers) quite well.

I think that (and his solid play on the PK) makes him more valuable than his point total would on its own. And if he can manage to score a few more goals this year, so much the better.

Posted by OlderThanChelios from Grand Rapids, MI on 07/17/14 at 02:11 PM ET

mrfluffy's avatar

Regarding Glendening…

What did people say about Kris Draper 20 years ago?

Exactly.

Posted by mrfluffy from A wide spot on I-90 in Montana on 07/17/14 at 02:42 PM ET

J.J. from Kansas's avatar

What did people say about Kris Draper 20 years ago?

Exactly.

Kris Draper’s worst season production-wise was the year after suffering a broken face, and had he put up THAT point pace in the same number of games that Glendening played this year, he’d have still outscored the guy by 3 points.

Draper’s career scoring pace is 2.5 times higher than Glendening’s

Posted by J.J. from Kansas on 07/17/14 at 02:50 PM ET

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It’s the wild, ululating overreaction to what is in actuality a tremendously minor signing that elicited my expression of a diminished opinion of the perspicacity of both bloggers and commenters here

What?!?! People other than you aren’t entitled to their opinions? What Freedom loving country do you live in?

which in turn led to the profound affectation of aggrieved anger by those who attach importance to that perception.

And you expected a different reaction when you chastised people for expression what they felt frustrated about? What planet of abusive love do you live on? I’d like to send the Deathstar their for some mop up work.

He was a sub half point guy when up last year and has a very weak defensive game.

True….barely. Anyone remember how many points Franzen had his first season with Detroit? D was at exactly 1/2 point per game too. I guess expectations can’t be made on a first season because according to HiHD D and Franzen should have been sent to GR after their first seasons as Wings. Remember Shanahan and Holmstrom….same thing, less than 1/2 a point per game…back to the AHL for those guys….nope. And Weiss, right now, I don’t think anyone can make any claims about him. He could be as good as a 2nd line player or as bad as on the IR all season again. Lets hope for him to return to full health. I’m not saying you are wrong, my friend, but just that the holes in your logic would result in a 100 goal season for Franzen.

Mantha and Pulkinnen are almost assuredly ahead of Jurco on the forward depth chart at this point, and I’d rather either of them up before having Jurco up again next year.

Please explain in more detail how you arrived at this conclusion - because just saying it is true is what you don’t like about other people’s arguments on other topics. Still, according to you success in lower leagues does not guarantee success in higher leagues. We have seen what Jurco can do in the AHL…we haven’t seen what Mantha has done in the AHL, right? So, the best you can say, is what everyone else says….speculation. If you are comparing first seasons in the AHL of Jurco and Pulkkinen then you could say that Pulkkinen has scored more points than Jurco did his first season - that might put him ahead of Jurco.

And all of that said, the odds that there are going to be less than 40-50 games in total injuries between those top 6 forwards

Can we hold you to that prediction?

Posted by J.J. from Kansas on 07/17/14 at 11:59 AM ET

Agreed. We’ve only seen one full season of Smith. I’d hardly throw in the towel on his potential just now. Again, if we are going by first season stats Kronwall wouldn’t be on the Wings right now. Keep in mind that Smith is played his first season on a team with less talent than Kronwall did—not that anyone made that comparison but me.

Posted by howeandhowe from Seattle on 07/17/14 at 03:28 PM ET

George Malik's avatar

Eric, a.k.a. HiHD, on behalf of myself and many readers both here in the comments section and the people who think that you’re an idiot in general:

If you don’t like what you’re reading, go find your own pool to continually piss in. All you do is talk shit about me, about my readers, about this blog, about everyone but yourself, and it’s *#$%@& boring.

You are indeed the “gigantic douchebag” you’ve been described as by those who suggest that you’re the one who’s ruining it for the rest of us, and while those folks find it amusing to watch your self-sanctimonious badgering of everyone who doesn’t think the way Eric thinks get beaten into pulp…

If you’re not going to stop basically stating that you think everyone who isn’t you is—and you use a whole bunch of fancy words to skirt around the term—essentially mentally handicapped, and all you do is jerk off here, maybe you’ve done a shitton of work proving that you shouldn’t be welcome here.

If it makes you feel any better, when the “shit’s gotta change” stuff starts, it usually starts with, “That idiot HockeyinHD,” but it’s not because people respect you or even loathe you. It’s because people think that you’re an utter joke of a caricature of a troll. And maybe that’s how we should treat you, given the way you treat us.

Posted by George Malik from South Lyon, MI on 07/17/14 at 03:44 PM ET

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The Malik Report is a destination for all things Red Wings-related. I offer biased, perhaps unprofessional-at-times and verbose coverage of my favorite team, their prospects and developmental affiliates. I've joined the Kukla's Korner family with five years of blogging under my belt, and I hope you'll find almost everything you need to follow your Red Wings at a place where all opinions are created equal and we're all friends, talking about hockey and the team we love to follow.