Kukla's Korner

The Malik Report

Red Wings morning news: more trade talk, cooking with campers and ‘Little Homer’

Updated 2x at 10:18 AM: Yesterday, Tyler Myers trade talk dominated Red Wings fans' discussions. I'm guessing that most of you will be more interested in MLive's Ansar Khan's "analysis" reaction to the Free Press's Helene St. James' Myers push than you will be interested in this morning's prospect news--with today's summer development camp ending in a scrimmage starting at 11 AM at Centre Ice Arena.

So...

Khan suggests that Washington Capitals defenseman Mike Green, who may or may not be available via the trade route, is the "best fit" in terms of addressing the Wings' needs for a right-shooting top-four defenseman:

[The Wings have] inquired about Buffalo's Tyler Myers, Edmonton's Jeff Petry and Toronto's Cody Franson – and others. But Green makes the most sense. The Capitals don't need him, and because he's entering the final year of his contract (at slightly more than $6 million), the cost of acquiring him shouldn't be as steep as it would be with the others.

Washington has eight defensemen on one-way contracts, one more than they need. Niskanen essentially replaces Green on the top power-play unit. The Capitals have just 12 forwards; they need one more and have only $1.1 million of cap space. Unloading Green would give them flexibility.

Injuries have hampered the 28-year-old Green in recent years – he's played more than 70 games only once since 2008-09. But he has a lot of offensive ability – he's a tremendous skater, moves the puck and can quarterback the power play.

The Red Wings need those skills and wouldn't be deterred by Green's defensive shortcomings.

What would the Red Wings be willing to part with to get Green? Teams looking to deal young defensemen have been asking for a top young forward or high-end prospect. If the Red Wings are reluctant to part with the likes of Gustav Nyquist, Tomas Tatar or Anthony Mantha (whom they consider untouchable) for someone like Myers, they're not going to relinquish that much for Green, who might amount to a one-year rental.

Khan believes that the Wings would try to move Jakub Kindl and his $2.4 million cap hit (for the next 3 years, per Capgeek) to accommodate Green's presence. However:

The Capitals don't need a defenseman, however. That could be a sticking point in talks with the Red Wings.

Detroit is desperate to make a move. Washington probably isn't in a rush to move Green. It can wait for the best offer this summer or move him early in the season.

I just don't know where exactly this "urgency" to make a move in early July comes from--there are still unrestricted free agents available, and the Capitals' cap issues don't have to be rectified until the "last day of training camp" (a.k.a. the day after the exhibition season ends in early October), but you'd think that the Wings need a defenseman right *#$%@& now given the way the beat writers are talking about trade-making.

Would Green be a solid fit? He's 28 going on 29 and is in the last year of a contract that has a $6.25 million cap hit. Given that the Wings have $9.25 million in cap space remaining, they'd definitely need to move some money in order to accommodate Green and re-sign Tomas Tatar, Danny DeKeyser (who are restricted free agents) and possibly Daniel Alfredsson (who's an unrestricted free agent), and the Sports Forecaster describes the 6'1," 207-pound defenseman as follows:

Assets:  Is a tremendous skater and a natural point producer from the back end. Often plays like a fourth forward on the ice, as he places constant pressure on opposing defenses. Packs an excellent wrister. Likes to initiate body contact. Can quarterback a power play with aplomb.

Flaws:  Is mistake-prone in the defensive zone, which negates some of his overall effectiveness. Still needs to add a little more consistency and discipline to his game. Injuries have become a problem for him recently, so he isn't nearly as dynamic since then.

Career Potential:  Excellent offensive defenseman, when healthy.

My problem with the concept of adding Green is simple: in addition to having missed significant time due to injuries in 3 of the past 4 seasons, the Capitals know that Green is an asset, and while they are indeed quite close to the salary cap's upper limit, the team has no restricted free agents to re-sign and no real reason to take someone who posted 38 points last year off a blueline which includes Green, Karl Alzner, John Carlson and now Matt Niskanen.

Just as importantly, new Capitals coach Barry Trotz has stated that he believes he can turn Green into a reclamation project, and Trotz's word seems to actually resonate with the Capitals' new GM, Brian MacLellan.

What would it cost to bring Green to Detroit? All I know is this: when St. James appeared on the radio in Toronto and Buffalo yesterday, their hosts brought up two players' names, and they weren't Tomas Jurco or Tomas Tatar: they were Gustav Nyquist and Anthony Mantha.

If a general manager is going to "help" the Wings fill their need for a top-four defenseman (Michael Del Zotto is still available on the market, yes, but he's kind of fallen off the map, too), that general manager is going to want to "help" the Wings divest themselves of the organization's best young players. Green is still viewed as something of a premium player here, and top-four defensemen who are inconsistent as can be and are injury-prone still fetch massive returns.

This article's Khan's "analysis" of the situation. It doesn't mean that the Red Wings are specificially saying, "Hey, we're going after Mike Green" or, "Hey, we're going after Mike Green over Tyler Myers."

It's July 8th, there are still free agents available for nothing but the price of their contract, teams can exceed the salary cap by 10% until October 5th, and this is not the time of year when, historically speaking, we see teams making trades out of deseperation.

Based upon the Wings' tendencies, I'd suggest that the team is most likely to head to training camp as-is, that the team is most likely to allow training camp and the exhibition season to determine whether Ryan Sproul, Xavier Ouellet, Alexey Marchenko, Mattias Backman and/or Nick Jensen are ready to take Kindl and Brian Lashoff's jobs, and then the team might act, given that players will get hurt during training camp and the exhibition season, producing a need for defensemen, allowing the Wings to alleviate any sort of roster crunch...

And I'd also suggest that the most likely scenario has the Wings to utilize whatever blueline comes out of training camp and the exhibition season into the year, with a trade at the trade deadline (when unrestricted free agents-to-be really are "rentals") serving as the most probable means by which the Wings will act if they feel that the defensive corps is not adequate at that time.

Trade talk in July generates a significant amount of discussion, but it tends not to generate a significant amount of actual action.

 

 

 

In an incredibly different vein, I know that Jiri Fischer's taken over the Wings' summer development camp not only because the medai availabilities are super-short and activities are kept to an in-the-morning basis, but also because the bagels are gone.  Centre Ice Arena used to have delicious, 500+-calorie bagels in big serving bowls at the players' breakfast table (I know because the rink staff would give me extra bagels from time to time). Now it's all whole-wheat or gluten-free bread, labeled and portioned out.

I also know that Fischer's taken over because those last-second deliveries of submarine sandwiches, pasta and sometimes pizza have been replaced with grocery-store runs for grapes.

The players take nutrition very seriously and the team takes it even more seriously, so DetroitRedWings.com's Bill Roose's article about the Wings' visit to Northwestern Michigan College served notice as to the team's ever-increasing commitment to having its players fuel their bodies as best as they possibly can. This morning, the Traverse City Record-Eagle's James Cook chronicles more of the trip, which was organized under the watchful eye of team nutritionist Lisa McDowell:

Last year’s inaugural Red Wings culinary class taught players how to make six dishes. This year’s had seven, plus two healthy snacks.

Whereas last year’s session had an instructor for each group and showed them how to make all six dishes, this year’s had nine stations that the groups of five rotated around as Culinary Institute Front-of-the-House director Patty Huhta kept time with a stopwatch to keep the event on time.

As instructor Joel Papcun showed the players how to grill fish, he even demonstrated where to put them over the heat to get criss-crossing grill marks to make it even more presentable.

“You learn about nutrition, but you don’t really learn how to make the food,” said Wings first-round pick Dylan Larkin, who doesn’t turn 18 until later this month. “You know what’s good for you, but not how to make it. It was really cool to see how to make some of the things. I never even thought about how food looks can affect the taste, like with the salmon.”

Eight chef instructors at Northwestern Michigan College’s Great Lakes Culinary Institute and several others volunteered to run the nine-station rotation that demonstrated to the players how to make guacamole, grilled corn on the cob, salmon, steak fajitas, spanish rice, black bean salad and sauteed swiss chard, as well two no-bake snacks. Part of the ease in those basic dishes is that the recipes aren’t exact and the athletes can cater them to their own tastes.

“We want the guys to be able to do this without measuring, so it’s easy to eyeball,” said McDowell, who provided kale, Swiss chard and tomatoes from her own garden.

Cook continues, and if you missed Roose's article...

[T]he cooking class is a tool for many of these players, said [Jared] Coreau, who is still making some of the recipes that he learned at last year’s development camp.

“We made a chicken parmesan with not as much breading on it,” he said. “We made an avocado and Greek yogurt spread for salmon fillets, which is really good. Quinoa, which is really good, and I hadn’t eaten until then and now I eat it every week, probably twice a week.”

Coreau, a 6-foot-5 goalie, easily devours 5,000 to 6,000 calories each day.

On an average day, his breakfast is a bowl of oatmeal with walnuts; a four-egg omelet with spinach, tomatoes and an English muffin for extra carbohydrates. By mid-morning he snacks on carrots or a fruit cup before starting a workout. For lunch, it’s two apples with two cans of tuna fish and walnuts mixed together with some vinegar. Later in the day, he has chicken, oranges, almonds, and for dinner it just meat, a lot of different-colored vegetables, and maybe a sweet potato. Before bed it’s a protein snack like yogurt with lots of berries.

Coreau’s chloric intake is necessary for him to maintain his 200-pound playing weight, but it’s not always easy to eat so much.

“I’m eating maybe 6-7 times throughout the day throwing in a few little snacks,” Coreau said. “There are times every day where I don’t want to eat but I know if I don’t I might lose a few pounds where in the season it’s so important to maintain weight. Everyone things, ‘Well, you have to work out.’ That’s part of it but eating is a huge thing.”

Also in the "If you missed it" category, the Free Press's Kirkland Crawford pointed out that a certain coach's son took the lead when the team played a little curling on Sunday:

 

 

 

I'd been looking for a foreign-language report involving a Wings prospect---they eventually pop up--and today, Norran's Arvid Marklund provides just that via a conversation with Axel Holmstrom (what follows is roughly translated):

"Everyone calls me Little Homer"

Axel Holmstrom had no choice when he arrived at the Detroit Red Wings' development camp. The classic jersey with the number 96 was hung up in his place.

Skelleftea AIK's talented center, Axel Holmstrom, who will embark upon his men's team season in the SHL, is currently in camp with the NHL's Detroit Red Wings--a team that chose Axel Holmstrom in the rookie draft a couple of weeks ago.

When Axel arrived at camp last week, he received a surprise as the classic Red Wings jersey with the number 96, which belonged to Tom "Homer" Holmstrom for avery long time, hung in his spot in the locker room..

"I had no choice," says Axel, and he laughs. "And all of them here call me 'Little Homer' and it's just damn funny. Actually, it's probably just the playing style that separates us, ha ha."

During the day, the camp combines both intra-squad games, practice and activities off the ice.

"It's a dream to be here. Everything's felt good and it's nice to come here and see how things work."

 

 

 

And finally, in alumni news, Patrick Eaves spoke with Fox Sports Southwest's Steve Hunt about joining the Dallas Stars...

Eaves, 30, had of course spent the bulk of his nine-year NHL career in Detroit, which is why [im] Nill, a former assistant GM with the Red Wings before being hired as Dallas' new GM in May 2013, was quite familiar with him. And Eaves' relationship with Nill indeed played a role in him deciding to come to Big D.

"Yeah, absolutely it was a huge factor, from knowing Jim from my time with the Wings. He's got a real good thing going down there. I know they're a hard team to play against and yeah, they're making moves. They're going places and I want to be a part of it," Eaves said on Monday.

Eaves spent most of last season in the Motor City, playing 25 games for the Wings before he was traded to the Nashville Predators prior to the NHL Trade Deadline on March 5, 2014. With the Preds, he appeared in five games before becoming an unrestricted free agent on July 1.

He wanted a destination where he would have a chance to again play for a winner like he had in Detroit, so he took the one-year deal and signed with the Stars.

"Yeah, we'll see what happens. It'll start with a one-year deal and hopefully I can come in and yeah, have a good year and help the team make the playoffs and then go from there," Eaves said. "I'm looking to help out and have a good year myself and then we'll see what happens."

 

Update: Slapshotgoal from Winging it in Motown wrote an excellent article about the Wings' attempts to rebuild some continuity of character from their NHL and AHL to ECHL affiliates:

That connection between the AHL and NHL last year was fantastic, but the consistency and quality of coaching did not translate to the ECHL Toledo Walleye, who were a complete dumpster fire. Largely as a result of the failure of that team, the Walley have a new head coach this year in Derek Lalonde, and have cut affiliation ties with Chicago. The Walleye will now be a Red Wings only ECHL team, with a new head coach who is friends with Jeff Blashill and a coach who the Wings organization believes will do a much better job in helping our young prospects develop into successful players. Derek Lalonde most recently coached the Green Bay Gamblers of the USHL, and like Blashill, is a former assistant coach at Ferris State, so he already has experience in developing young player. Lalonde is one of the coaches here in development camp, is already working with the kids,learning more about how Blashill coaches, and what exactly the Wings expect from their players, as well as the coaches. This is the first time, to the best of my knowledge, that the ECHL coach has ever been in attendance, much less participated. I'm impressed and very pleased to see this, because none of the Wings kids in Toledo last year were any good at all, and I know some of them could have been, and should have been, much better. Jared Coreau's rookie pro season? I've crumpled it up and thrown it away, it's meaningless to me because it's not at all indicative of the goalie he is and what he can do. Even Jiri Fischer mentioned the "quality" of the Walleye team when asked about Coreau's rough season. That entire team was garbage, and on a garbage team with poor coaching, how can you expect young players to grow and improve? I'm very pleased with the changes the Walleye have made so far, and I think it's going to make a big difference in player development at the ECHL level.

 

Update #2: MLive's Brendan Savage penned an article about Dylan Larkin (via RedWingsFeed):

"I grew up watching the Wings and never thought I'd be here," he said. "But it's pretty cool. Everyone is supporting me, which is good. There's no pressure because everyone is rooting me on.".

Unlike some of the other campers who are preparing to begin their pro careers this season, Larkin hopes to take the college route to the NHL. He's headed to Michigan to play under former Red Wings center Red Berenson.Larkin, who turns 18 on July 30, grew up as a Michigan fan but that isn't the reason he decided to become a Wolverine.

"Just the coaching staff and the history there," he said. "Red Berenson, Billy Powers and especially Brian Wiseman. They're all so passionate about hockey and developing their players and moving them on to the next level. I could see that form Day 1."

Larkin describes himself as a two-way center who is hard to play against, moves the puck well up the ice well and makes plays.

Before embarking on a pro career, he hopes to increase his strength, be stronger on the puck down low against big defensemen and make the players around him better.

At the development camp, he's played alongside 2013 first-round pick Anthony Mantha -- perhaps the most highly touted Red Wings prospect ever -- and he sits next to the two-time 50-goal scorer in the dressing room.

Filed in: | The Malik Report | Permalink
 

Comments

Avatar

The Capitals know he’s an asset, but Khan does point out that they are in need of cap relief. A quick look at Capgeek and I can see why. They can’t really start the season as is, and his contract moved would mean they can add a top six forward, which it looks like they need.
I’m usually a defender of Mule and avoid talk of his trade, but he could actually be a good chip for a straight-up trade in this instance.
But look at me, spinning wheels. I agree none of this shizz ever happens and more likely than not they’ll begin the season as-is. I think they’d be missing an opportunity here.

Posted by geoffreypelkey on 07/08/14 at 08:42 AM ET

LivinLaVidaLockout's avatar

“Do you want to change your name to Homer Jr.? The kids can call you HoJu.”

~Homer Simpson

Posted by LivinLaVidaLockout on 07/08/14 at 08:49 AM ET

George Malik's avatar

The Capitals aren’t going to want Franzen. They’re going to want Nyquist. That’s the issue here—it isn’t reclamation project for reclamation project. Teams want to “help” themselves to the Wings’ best prospects.

If the Wings can work a deal out that doesn’t involve giving away the horses, the barn and the farm away for one player, I’d be fine with it, but Nyquist and Mantha are the first player(s) teams want, and I’d guess that the Caps’ asking price for Green would be similar to Buffalo’s—an established and young NHL player, a top prospect and a 1st-round pick.

Posted by George Malik from South Lyon, MI on 07/08/14 at 09:20 AM ET

Avatar

I guess Im under the assumption that being up against the cap and needing help down at center in return would lessen the leverage they have over what they could expect. But I get what you’re saying too and don’t see it happening in reality.

Posted by geoffreypelkey on 07/08/14 at 09:39 AM ET

J.J. from Kansas's avatar

I’d guess that the Caps’ asking price for Green would be similar to Buffalo’s—an established and young NHL player, a top prospect and a 1st-round pick.

Perhaps if Green were signed for five more years instead of one, but I don’t imagine that Washington is realistically expecting this return for a reclamation project with just one year left on his contract.

In reality, I believe Washington would be looking for one cost-controlled NHL player and MAYBE a mid-late pick.

Posted by J.J. from Kansas on 07/08/14 at 09:39 AM ET

Avatar

but you’d think that the Wings need a defenseman right *#$%@& now given the way the beat writers are talking about trade-making.

Do you think the writers could be getting this sense from the team?

And not to voice the unthinkable, but could the Wings be worried about ticket sales?  A very disappointing season and postseason, followed be a whiff in free agency, can’t be great for fan interest.

Posted by captaineclectic on 07/08/14 at 09:43 AM ET

George Malik's avatar

As the regular season draws closer, that may very well happen, but this whole, “Wings are DESPERATE TO MAKE A MOVE RIGHT BOOKING NOW” shit doesn’t take into account that mid-summer asking prices are going to be extraordinarily high. As of right now, Green’s price is likely massive. In two or three months, that should change, but I don’t think that anyone is going to “help” the Wings for a next-to-nothin’ return.

Posted by George Malik from South Lyon, MI on 07/08/14 at 09:44 AM ET

DocF's avatar

Green, if really healthy, is worth a second round pick at best.  His lack of defensive play makes him a major liability.  Have any of the fans who think he might help ever concentrated on him while watching the Capitals play?  I have.  If you think Quincy has issues, look at this guy and you will think Q is the second coming of Bobby Orr.

Doc

Posted by DocF from Now: Lynn Haven, FL; was Reidsville, NC on 07/08/14 at 09:49 AM ET

Avatar

I always hear that prices are going to fall, but it isn’t ever clear that they do.

I certainly wouldn’t expect Green (or Byfuglien, whom I’d prefer) to be cheap per se, I just think there’s a pretty big gap between Nyquist-or-Mantha-and-a-first and “next-to-nothin’”.

Posted by captaineclectic on 07/08/14 at 09:51 AM ET

Avatar

I agree with DocF, I don’t really see how bringing another offensive puck moving defensmen onto the team will really help. We already have Smith, and Quincey was touted as that same thing when we traded for him a few years ago. Both of them lay eggs in the D zone or take dumb penalties on a regular basis, do we really want another one? Wouldn’t a smart stay at home d-man be a better fit?  Kindl had an off season last year but 2 years ago I thought he was actually quite good especially in the later half of that season when they put him on the PP. Personally I think Green is only marginally better than Kindl, definitely not worth giving up a Tatar or Jurco for, let alone a Nyquist or Mantha.

Posted by Shanny_Fan on 07/08/14 at 10:10 AM ET

Avatar

Personally I think Green is only marginally better than Kindl

Now we’re being ridiculous.

If Detroit’s #6 defenseman is only marginally worse than Mike Green, why did our defense and our powerplay perform at below-average levels?

Posted by captaineclectic on 07/08/14 at 10:13 AM ET

George Malik's avatar

Posted by George Malik from South Lyon, MI on 07/08/14 at 10:22 AM ET

Avatar

Point taken—I’ll play nicer.

Shanny, please let me re-phrase.  If Kindl was almost as good as Mike Green, a two-time first-team all-star who has scored over a hundred NHL goals, I would expect us to have a better-than-average defense or at least a better-than-average power play.

We didn’t last year, and as of right now we’re icing the same blueline.  So I don’t consider it plausible that Kindl is almost as good as Green—you’re either overrating Kindl, underrating Green, or, very likely, both.

Posted by captaineclectic on 07/08/14 at 10:26 AM ET

J.J. from Kansas's avatar

The big drop-off in production from Green is frightening, but he put up 38 points last year.  His best years were super-sheltered using a system/usage scheme that the Red Wings would not recreate for him, so you’re not getting a 70-point defenseman if you’re getting Mike Green, but if you can get one that puts up 40 points for a $6M cap hit without spending big assets? Yes, that upgrades your defense.

Hell, you don’t have to approach anywhere NEAR 40 points for it to be an upgrade on the defense. Danny DeKeyser managed second on the team with 23 points. Nobody else hit 20. Green’s hit being $6M this year doesn’t mean that much either. If everybody is healthy, then you don’t need extra space. If people aren’t healthy, then you collect the space using LTIR. Since the assumption is that a move for a D-Man means Kindl being gone, Green’s effective cap usage is $3.6M above Kindl (and yes, Green is better than Kindl by a lot).

I’m not against the idea of a stay-at-home defenseman, but I’m worried about the definition of them. It seems to me that ideally the stay-at-home guys are the ones who do good things away from the puck, but more-commonly, it’s really been come to be used to defend guys who are bad with the puck, don’t have it often, and don’t help their teammates keep it by nature of their awesome stay-at-hominess.

My preferred solution to the need to keep guys away from your crease is to never let them have the puck. A guy who clears the crease twice as effectively as a puck-mover isn’t better for your team if the puck-mover is 2x better at keeping the puck away from your crease in the first place. This is especially true since it means that he’s ALSO 2x better at getting the puck near the opponent’s crease.

Trench warfare hockey is dying. Get mobile or get dead.

Posted by J.J. from Kansas on 07/08/14 at 10:58 AM ET

Avatar

an established and young NHL player, a top prospect and a 1st-round pick

.

Very few players are worth this, much less a “reclamation project” even one as good as Green.

Posted by Bay Area Wings fan on 07/08/14 at 11:16 AM ET

Avatar

Green isn’t the be-all, end-all, but I would think he’s as good an option to improve the power play as Boyle would have been, and a short contract too.  And his 38 points in 70 games last year with a cap hit of $6M is way better than paying Kyle Quincey $4.25 in hopes that he can replicate that whopper of a 13-point season last year…

It’s too bad that Holland had to go out and make a panic-signing on the 1st rather than taking a step back to consider options.

Having Quincey reallyt mucks things up because if you bring in Green then it’s one more one-way contract that Detroit has to deal with and it makes it even less likely that a Ouellet, Marchenko or Sproul get a good look this year.

I can’t imagine finding anyone who would trade for Kindl or Lashoff rather than picking up a cheap UFA like Del Zotto, so the only real option is probably to bury them both in Grand Rapids.

Posted by Garth on 07/08/14 at 11:37 AM ET

Avatar

Very few players are worth this,

To pick an example—Ryan Kesler didn’t draw it.  He drew a 25-year old with one 20-goal season (e.g., a player less valuable than Tatar, much less Nyquist), a third-pairing defenseman with injury issues, and a 1st rounder.

 

Posted by captaineclectic on 07/08/14 at 11:38 AM ET

Down River Dan's avatar

I really hope the team, before they trade away one of the talented young forwards in an effort to land a NHL calibre defenseman, will at least give the young D-men a shot .

After training camp, and a few weeks of the season, I would guess babs/Holland would know if they are/aren’t ready(maybe they already know if the kids are ready???).

At that point, if need be, then investigate a trade. Not sure what the rush to make a deal now is?

Posted by Down River Dan on 07/08/14 at 11:38 AM ET

Avatar

I can’t imagine finding anyone who would trade for Kindl or Lashoff rather than picking up a cheap UFA like Del Zotto, so the only real option is probably to bury them both in Grand Rapids.

Lashoff can just be waived.

Kindl will have some limited value later this summer/early fall.

Posted by captaineclectic on 07/08/14 at 11:39 AM ET

Avatar

Green brings the element we do not have and has only 1 year left on his contract. If we do not have to lose any of Tatar, Nyquist, Jurco or Mantha (which might be wishful thinking), I will be OK with Green and then we can evaluate him next summer if he is worth a long term deal. He immediately becomes our best PP option from a blue line as Kron is not capable of getting the puck through traffic and Smith is not given an opportunity by Babcock.
Speaking of Quincey, Nashville just signed Volchenkov for 1 year at $1 mil. Now you are going to tell me that Quincey is better than Volchenkov by 1 year and $3.25 mil dollars?
The point is defensemen like Quincey are always available weeks after July 1 and could be had at little to no money. I believe Morris is available and probably could be had at 1 year at less than $2 mil dollars and could help us more than Q (or at least same as Q). This was another panic move by KH and now he is desperate again and I just pray he is not going to give us something like Tatar, Jurco and a first for 1 year of Green.

Posted by VPalmer on 07/08/14 at 12:11 PM ET

Avatar

If the asking price is Nyquist, no way I make that trade. Frankly, I think giving up Tatar might be too much for Green. If no money is going back in the deal, a 2nd round pick sounds like a more appropriate deal or maybe Jurco.

The Quincey signing does complicate matters. With him on board, adding Green would take away one spot I was hoping would be open to competition among the young players. I was hopeful one or two of those young players would steal a spot from Kindl and/or Lashoff.

Green has the skills the Wings need. Unfortunately, he also has the deficiencies that cannot afford to have more of. It would be the same if they tried to acquire Byfuglien. He’s atrocious on defense.

Posted by evileye on 07/08/14 at 12:12 PM ET

Avatar

Speaking of Quincey, Nashville just signed Volchenkov for 1 year at $1 mil. Now you are going to tell me that Quincey is better than Volchenkov by 1 year and $3.25 mil dollars?
The point is defensemen like Quincey are always available weeks after July 1 and could be had at little to no money. I believe Morris is available and probably could be had at 1 year at less than $2 mil dollars and could help us more than Q (or at least same as Q).

FWIW I’d rather have Quincey at this point than Volchenkov, but I take your larger point.

Frankly, I think giving up Tatar might be too much for Green. If no money is going back in the deal, a 2nd round pick sounds like a more appropriate deal or maybe Jurco.

I think Tatar’s value is lower than Jurco’s.

Posted by captaineclectic on 07/08/14 at 12:16 PM ET

Avatar

The other thing, will Babcock use Green properly? I mean, Smith is an offensive defenseman who is not seeing any PP time and being used on PK.
Dekeyser, on the other hand, is a defensive dman and he gets PP time. Babcock could be very unorthodox in how he sees the game, so he might start “teaching” Green how to play defense before he sees any time on a PP.

Posted by VPalmer on 07/08/14 at 12:22 PM ET

Avatar

As I mentioned before I do not see Tatar being here long term, maybe 2-4 more years (at least this is my feeling on it), so as mush as I love him, I will trade him for the right dman, but not for Green.

Posted by VPalmer on 07/08/14 at 12:25 PM ET

Avatar

I mean, Smith is an offensive defenseman who is not seeing any PP time and being used on PK.

Smith isn’t a righty though.  The only real danger with Green is that, finally having a righty, Babcock will overplay him.  First PP unit, second PP unit, PK, first light right wing, second line right wing, third line right wing…

The Quincey signing does complicate matters. With him on board, adding Green would take away one spot I was hoping would be open to competition among the young players.

Even without adding Green the Wings (assuming they re-sign DeKeyser, which is a given) are already at seven one-way contracts.  Even if they decide to carry eight defensemen it will be tough for that 8th guy to get much time.

Posted by Garth on 07/08/14 at 12:32 PM ET

Avatar

Green’s value is definitely lower than what Washington is probably asking for out of the gate. Mantha, Tatar, Gus, Jurco should all be a definite no going back. Two thoughts:

Why not ask for John Carlson instead? What would you give up for him? Younger, smaller contract, healthier. The Caps now have 3 right-handed offensive minded D.

Going back to Green. You may be able to pry him away for Helm and Miller or Abby and a pick.

Posted by AZWinger on 07/08/14 at 01:01 PM ET

HockeytownOverhaul's avatar

No thanks.  No trades I want to make at this point.  We got guys in the stable.. Use them.

Posted by HockeytownOverhaul on 07/08/14 at 01:02 PM ET

MoreShoot's avatar

Even without adding Green the Wings (assuming they re-sign DeKeyser, which is a given) are already at seven one-way contracts.  Even if they decide to carry eight defensemen it will be tough for that 8th guy to get much time.

That’s why I’d move Lashoff and Kindl and promote Marchenko and Ouellet/Backman.

Posted by MoreShoot on 07/08/14 at 01:37 PM ET

Avatar

doesn’t take into account that mid-summer asking prices are going to be extraordinarily high. As of right now, Green’s price is likely massive. In two or three months, that should change, but I don’t think that anyone is going to “help” the Wings for a next-to-nothin’ return.

Here we are again with this. So, prices are extraordinarily high at the draft, in the summer, and at the deadline i.e. they are ALWAYS extraordinarily high for the Red Wings. Never mind the fact that other teams can swing trades, rather large ones, regularly. I’m not advocating we trade the entire farm…I don’t want to. The constant “prices” refrain from many that cover the Wings just gets to me.

Posted by A II R on 07/08/14 at 01:47 PM ET

Avatar

A few names I’d thought I’d throw out there.

Doug Murray and Brendan Morrow

Both inexpensive, reliable, gritty veterans that can really help the team.  I know Murray is a lefty but when was the last d-man the team had that cleared the crease?

Posted by bababooey on 07/08/14 at 01:56 PM ET

Avatar

A few names I’d thought I’d throw out there.

Doug Murray and Brendan Morrow

Both inexpensive, reliable, gritty veterans that can really help the team.  I know Murray is a lefty but when was the last d-man the team had that cleared the crease?

Doug Murray is terrible. Awful. The pretty much worst guy you could possibly go out and sign. He can’t move. His advanced stats are awful as well.

Posted by A II R on 07/08/14 at 02:01 PM ET

Avatar

Trading any NHL-ready player for Green that is any asset to the team would be an absolute waste as he’d be a rental.

I think the big D just needs to sit tight with last years cast and cross fingers on injuries.  If there’s one thing you gotta give Q, he didn’t exactly have a steady D partner as the rest of the team played musical chairs with injuries.  Yes, I’d bet on more injuries than less injuries as it has been an extremely rough few years for the Wings on that front but as always this team has top-5 overall potential w/o them.

Posted by neffernin on 07/08/14 at 02:23 PM ET

Avatar

I totally agree that signing KFQ was a knee-jerk reaction that may come back to haunt us. The only way one of the kids comes up now, assuming DeKeyser is resigned, which he will be, is if Lashoff is scratched or is sent to GR on waivers, or one of the existing D-men goes down with an injury, which will probably happen at some point. But one injury and one instance of Lashoff being scratched would open up two slots. This is when the GR Dmen either Marchenko, Oullett, Sproul or Backman) will get their chance. I just don’t see Jensen ready to play at the NHL level yet.

Posted by Heresy from Aiken, SC on 07/08/14 at 02:34 PM ET

awould's avatar

I’m not overly high on Green. He would help the team undoubtedly, but I think he’d be overvalued by Washington so any trade they would make would be too much for Detroit to give. So the big worry is that KH would give’em what they want.

Posted by awould on 07/08/14 at 02:36 PM ET

Avatar

Trading any NHL-ready player for Green that is any asset to the team would be an absolute waste as he’d be a rental.

We don’t actually know that.  He’s 28 and could certainly re-sign if acquired.  (If you haven’t noticed, Detroit’s better at re-signing guys than it is at acquiring them.)  With the cap expected to jump again it wouldn’t be at all surprising to see him land in Detroit one way or the other, honestly.

Posted by captaineclectic on 07/08/14 at 02:56 PM ET

Avatar

I think the big D just needs to sit tight with last years cast and cross fingers on injuries.

In what way are injuries going to help Detroit?  If some team has a lot of injuries they’re going to start looking to deal a PP quarterback?

I don’t get that logic at all.

it wouldn’t be at all surprising to see him land in Detroit one way or the other, honestly.

There’s a thought.  And wouldn’t it be better to have him on a tryout for the last year of his contract rather than just overpaying to land him as a UFA?

Posted by Garth on 07/08/14 at 03:38 PM ET

Avatar

you’re either overrating Kindl, underrating Green, or, very likely, both

You are probably a bit right about both, but I see the potential for Kindl to be a solid 2nd pair guy and I dont see Green as anything more than a 2nd pair guy. His last elite season was 2009, now he generates as many opportunities as he digs puck out of the back of his net. Our D got lit up last year mainly because they are still young for d-men and we were missing more than half of our centremen for the majority of the season, 5 of our top 4 centermen at 1 point if you include Z as a centreman.

It would be nice to get a top 4 d-man to bump either quincey or smith down to the 3rd pair but Green is a minor upgrade IMO and his defensive play along with some lazy forwards was a reason that washington got lit up so much last year.

Not being the 2nd most injured team in the league as we have the last two seasons in a row should be our biggest upgrade, and will help our d and goaltending look way better.

Posted by Shanny_Fan on 07/08/14 at 04:36 PM ET

Avatar

In what way are injuries going to help Detroit?  If some team has a lot of injuries they’re going to start looking to deal a PP quarterback?

I’m not sure what you are talking about but Detroit’s defense was in a fairly constant state of flux last year and they were almost exactly average in terms of defense.  If they keep a stable cast (at least in top 4) it seems they’d have a hard time being worse.  Additionally if the cast in front of the defense isn’t in as much of a state of flux again it seems the trajectory is upwards in terms of defensive performance.

 

Posted by neffernin on 07/08/14 at 04:56 PM ET

Add a Comment

Please limit embedded image or media size to 575 pixels wide.

Add your own avatar by joining Kukla's Korner, or logging in and uploading one in your member control panel.

Captchas bug you? Join KK or log in and you won't have to bother.

Smileys

Notify me of follow-up comments?

Feed

Most Recent Blog Posts

About The Malik Report

The Malik Report is a destination for all things Red Wings-related. I offer biased, perhaps unprofessional-at-times and verbose coverage of my favorite team, their prospects and developmental affiliates. I've joined the Kukla's Korner family with five years of blogging under my belt, and I hope you'll find almost everything you need to follow your Red Wings at a place where all opinions are created equal and we're all friends, talking about hockey and the team we love to follow.