Kukla's Korner

The Malik Report

Before Training Camp Starts

from Ansar Khan of Mlive,

Will Andreas Athanasiou be back? What moves will be made to become cap compliant? How will the logjam on defense be resolved? Can someone from the Calder Cup champion Grand Rapids Griffins claim a job?

"Lots of decisions on our team have probably been made," general manager Ken Holland said. "There's possibly one or two spots open."

The Red Wings hope they don't need to fill Athanasiou's spot. The restricted free agent is one of the organization's top, young forwards, with elite speed and a promising offensive outlook after scoring 18 goals in 64 games during his first full season.

The club has offered a two-year, $3.8 million deal. Athanasiou's agent said he is considering more lucrative KHL offers.

"Whenever I do contracts, as anyone in the industry, it's based on comparables," Holland said. "There's a list of comparables. He has to decide."

If Athanasiou bolts, it might create an opportunity for one of two veterans on pro tryouts, PA Parenteau or David Booth, to land a contract. Or it might enable a prospect to earn a job.

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Comments

Down River Dan's avatar

...it might create an opportunity for one of two veterans on pro tryouts, PA Parenteau or David Booth, to land a contract….

Just the sort of exciting - hanging on veteran - type players to pack the seats of your new arena.. sick

Posted by Down River Dan on 09/13/17 at 06:58 AM ET

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——Lots of decisions on our team have probably been made,” general manager Ken Holland said.

In the meantime: It’ll be nice, especially in training camp, to have some spots open, to create a little more intensity,” Holtby said. “The last few years we’ve basically had our roster, and everyone knew that. Guys were fighting for call-ups. This year, with so many roster spots open, it should really prepare us for Game 1.

So, one of the worst teams in the East is all set. One of the best will have competition for the roster spots.

Posted by VPalmer on 09/13/17 at 07:29 AM ET

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Quit lying KH, that comparable crap doesn’t fly anymore. You keep espousing the same stuff your full of. You also get to see what a horrible mistake you made by losing Nosek. Again it’s your failure to recognize talent.

Posted by stateofmifan on 09/13/17 at 08:35 AM ET

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You also get to see what a horrible mistake you made by losing Nosek. Again it’s your failure to recognize talent.

I think Vegas taking Nosek is not so much indication about Nosek’s talent, but more about how they felt about Sheahan and XO.

Posted by VPalmer on 09/13/17 at 08:55 AM ET

MoreShoot's avatar

...it might create an opportunity for one of two veterans on pro tryouts, PA Parenteau or David Booth, to land a contract….

Just the sort of exciting - hanging on veteran - type players to pack the seats of your new arena.

... you mean the one featuring $40 parking and $15 drinks?  I can park on my couch for free.

Posted by MoreShoot on 09/13/17 at 08:56 AM ET

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Posted by VPalmer on 09/13/17 at 09:55 AM ET
For the most part I agree, but having a full cap space and trying to build a winner, they not only feel Nosek is more bang for the buck, but he has more potential than any of our unprotected players. That’s why I always post about recognizing talent or the lack thereof.Sad.

Posted by stateofmifan on 09/13/17 at 09:29 AM ET

OlderThanChelios's avatar

“Whenever I do contracts, as anyone in the industry, it’s based on comparables,” Holland said. “There’s a list of comparables. He has to decide.”

So in Ken Holland’s warped world, AA is 5% better than Glendenning, and that’s why he’s offering him $100k more per season? But, then again, I guess he can’t use any of his own players as “comparables” because he’s handed out so many ridiculously bad contracts in the last few years.

Man, every time Holland opens his mouth, I hate him just a little bit more.

Posted by OlderThanChelios from Grand Rapids, MI on 09/13/17 at 10:05 AM ET

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“Whenever I do contracts, as anyone in the industry, it’s based on comparables,” Holland said. “There’s a list of comparables. He has to decide.”

Haha. I wish I had media credentials. I would love to challenge Kenny on this.

When you gave Abby a 7-year extension for almost $30M, what comparables were you using? Which players spent 4 or 5 years as a bottom 6 winger, then magically score 23 goals playing with Pav and Zee, and immediately earn a 7-year extension at age 28? Be specific Kenny. Which guys get 7-year deals in that situation. Months before Abby signed, Brandon Sutter signed a 5-year contract with a similar cap hit. Not 7, but 5 years. Sutter was younger than Abby, played center which is more important, had two seasons with 21 goals, several others 13,14,17 goals (as opposed to Abby being a 7-10 goal guy before his big 1st line promotion). Did I mention he played center and was younger too. Matthieu Perrault had 4 straight seasons of 40+ points. He signed for similar dollars as Abby. But only 4 years, you know, like any sane GM would do. How about Zack Smith, a rugged winger in Ottawa. Same age as Abby. Scored 14 goals as a rookie. Then 13. Then busts out for 25. Did he get a $4.25M x 7 year extension until age 35? Nope. $3.25M x just 4 years. Remember, he scored 25 goals, and didn’t do that playing with Pav and Zee.

Could do the same exercise on Helm, Glendummy, etc…Why the media let’s him spew this BS without calling him out boggles my mind.

Posted by fatsavage on 09/13/17 at 10:52 AM ET

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Again it’s your failure to recognize talent.

I honestly do not think Nosek is such a great talent and will be really missed. I will definitely prefer him at less than $1 mil than Glen at $1.8 or Helm at $4 mil though.

Posted by VPalmer on 09/13/17 at 11:11 AM ET

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Man, every time Holland opens his mouth, I hate him just a little bit more.

Couldn’t have summed up my own feelings any better.

Posted by Ilovekermit on 09/13/17 at 11:25 AM ET

MoreShoot's avatar

“Whenever I do contracts, as anyone in the industry, it’s based on comparables,”

What was Abby’s comparable?

Posted by MoreShoot on 09/13/17 at 11:28 AM ET

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Whenever I do contracts, as anyone in the industry, it’s based on comparables,”

What was Abby’s comparable?

Posted by MoreShoot on 09/13/17 at 12:28 PM ET

See above. Would love to ask that question. Many guys that had a more consistent production history, were getting 4-5 years at the most, and often for less dollars. Brandon Sutter was literally signed a couple months before Abby. But I guess Kenny wasn’t using that as a comparable. Maybe he figured Abby was more of an Ovechkin-type so figured $4.25M with an NTC was a pretty big discount for the next 7 seasons. Fu%^^$& idiot.

Posted by fatsavage on 09/13/17 at 11:34 AM ET

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What was Abby’s comparable?

Abby’s a special case though, because who could ever have predicted that his production would go down? He is and always has been a natural goal scorer -a sniper, if you will- and just needed a little bit of time to grow into that.

Posted by CharDeeMacDennis on 09/13/17 at 11:54 AM ET

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..it might create an opportunity for one of two veterans on pro tryouts, PA Parenteau or David Booth, to land a contract

...and Kenny’s pants got a tighter until a little wet spot developed

Posted by benzanato on 09/13/17 at 11:59 AM ET

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What was Abby’s comparable?

Bickell?

Posted by VPalmer on 09/13/17 at 02:13 PM ET

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What was Abby’s comparable?

Bickell?

Posted by VPalmer on 09/13/17 at 03:13 PM ET

Bickell’s career high was 17 goals and 37 points. He followed that up with 9 goals during the lockout (equivalent to 15 goals over 82 games). Then he exploded for 9 more goals in 23 playoff games. That earned him a big payday. So at age 27…he signed for…$4.25M x 7 years. Oops. That was Abby. Bickell got $4M x 4 years. Guy gets 9 goals, 17 points in 23 playoff games…and gets a 4-year contract. Abby scores 23 goals courtesy of Pav and Zee and gets a 7-year mega deal.

I really think Zach Smith is a great comparable. Rugged power winger. Scored in the teens a couple years. Busts out for 25 goals. And that earns him $3.25M x 4 years. Abby gets an extra $1M and 3 extra years, plus the NTC. But he’s from Michigan so that counts for a lot.

Posted by fatsavage on 09/13/17 at 02:50 PM ET

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I still think Bickel is a good comparison. Like Abby, he is/was a mediocre skilled power forward who made a name for himself playing on a line with great players. As a result both got unreasonable deals.

Posted by VPalmer on 09/13/17 at 03:19 PM ET

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I still think Bickel is a good comparison. Like Abby, he is/was a mediocre skilled power forward who made a name for himself playing on a line with great players. As a result both got unreasonable deals.

Posted by VPalmer on 09/13/17 at 04:19 PM ET

Agree Bickell was overpaid. But $4M x 4 years sounds incredibly better than $4.25M x 7 years. So this is why I would love to ask Kenny which comparables he used for Abby?? Show me a 28-year old winger that scored 20+ once in his entire life (when anyone could see was the result of his newfound promotion to the #1 line), and then earns a massive 7-year extension. Give me one comparable Kenny! By the time of Abby’s signing, the Bickell lesson was clear for all GMs. But not Kenny.

 

Posted by fatsavage on 09/13/17 at 03:59 PM ET

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In KH mind he signed Abby to a 5 year deal. “We will worry about years 6 and 7 when we get there”  he famously said. Of course, there was a number of red flags KH decided to ignore when signing Abby. Age, injuries/style of play, no Dats, etc.
And, of course, it had to be done in the middle of the season, because I guess half of the league was waiting for Abby to hit free agency.

Posted by VPalmer on 09/13/17 at 04:07 PM ET

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And, of course, it had to be done in the middle of the season, because I guess half of the league was waiting for Abby to hit free agency.

Posted by VPalmer on 09/13/17 at 05:07 PM ET

He was signed in November to be exact. So 7 months before he became a free agent. Glendening was signed 12 months in advance. Those were special cases. Other players have to wait and see what kind of cap space is left.

Posted by fatsavage on 09/13/17 at 05:06 PM ET

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Ken, the term comparables implies just that, since ice time varies, use TTOI, separate 5v5/60 and PP and short handed goals. If all things are equal take into effect explosive plays. AA is the last player to go end to end and score and Datsyuk is the last player I recall able to pull that off in Detroit. But you know or should know all these stats anyway, but you think we’re dumb enough to buy what your selling, WRONG. It’s insulting.

Posted by stateofmifan on 09/13/17 at 05:27 PM ET

ilovehomers's avatar

Also comparable players who had a shot % way above normal that eventually regressed. Cant forget that!

Posted by ilovehomers on 09/13/17 at 06:24 PM ET

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oh man. I can’t wait for Abbey’s contract to be over so he can sign another one that’s more like Rick DiPietro’s contract. He’s still getting paid, right?

Posted by howeandhowe from Seattle on 09/13/17 at 09:00 PM ET

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The Malik Report is a destination for all things Red Wings-related. I offer biased, perhaps unprofessional-at-times and verbose coverage of my favorite team, their prospects and developmental affiliates. I've joined the Kukla's Korner family with five years of blogging under my belt, and I hope you'll find almost everything you need to follow your Red Wings at a place where all opinions are created equal and we're all friends, talking about hockey and the team we love to follow.

 

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