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Videos- The Tampa Bay Lightning Question The OT Game Wining Goal

from Eduardo A. Encina of the Tampa Bay Times,

Jon Cooper rarely struggles to find the right words, but the Lightning coach stepped to the podium late Wednesday and waged a visible battle with his emotions while gathering his thoughts.

His team’s dream of making history now hangs by a thread, the Lightning on the brink of losing the Stanley Cup final with a 3-2 overtime loss to the Avalanche in Game 4 at Amalie Arena.

The Avalanche lead the series three games to one. Game 5 is Friday at Denver.

The Lightning had their opportunities to win, dominating the Avalanche early while taking a quick lead, but they couldn’t put the Avalanche away. They battled injuries into overtime, playing with just five healthy defensemen a good chunk of the night.

And moments after watching Colorado celebrate following forward Nazem Kadri’s goal with 7:58 remaining in overtime, Cooper was distraught.

Cooper didn’t provide details for his view, but the Lightning believed Kadri’s goal was scored with too many Colorado men on the ice. Screen shots showed six Colorado skaters were on the ice as Kadri closed in on the goal before beating Lightning goaltender Andrei Vasilevskiy. A video angle also showed forward Nathan MacKinnon going slowly to the bench after Kadri jumped over the boards.

continued

Below, watch Jon Cooper post-game and a video where you can make the call.

Cooper

 

 

Too many men?

 

Another

 

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Comments

Paul's avatar

from Joe Smith of The Athletic,

What Cooper wasn’t willing to discuss — at least publicly — was what replays clearly showed, that Nazem Kadri’s OT winner came on a missed too-many-men-on-the-ice call, one that can’t be reviewed or challenged. Kadri seemingly came off the bench four seconds before Nathan MacKinnon came off the ice, a the difference in distance of 42 feet. But all Cooper would say is that his team, the one built on guts and guile, should still be fighting.

There’s no recourse, no do-overs. Just the pain and what-ifs….

There was a delayed reaction on the Kadri winner by almost everyone, with his wrist shot sneaking under the right arm of Andrei Vasilevskiy and sticking to the netting atop the goal. Only Bowen Byram raised his arm initially, saying he saw the puck flip the net up. But it was almost like everyone in the sellout crowd at Amalie Arena didn’t want to believe it. The players appeared in shock.

“A tough one to swallow,” Victor Hedman said.

The relentlessly resilient championship group — the one that refuses to die — has their season on life support, needing to win three in a row, starting Friday in Denver.

more ($$$) on the loss

Posted by Paul from Motown Area on 06/23/22 at 04:40 AM ET

RedMenace's avatar

Boo. *#$%@&. Hoo.

You “cheat” every game, on practically every line change, and now you want to literally cry about it?

Excuse me if I can’t find any *#$%@& to toss your way, Tampa.

Posted by RedMenace from A Tormented Hellscape on 06/23/22 at 05:50 AM ET

SauceBoss's avatar

Tampa Bay. The sorest f*ckin losers in the league

Posted by SauceBoss on 06/23/22 at 08:59 AM ET

Kaszycki and his Krew's avatar

such a call (potentially) cost the Islanders the Stanley Cup last year.  And Tampa was the beneficiary.

If interested, take a look at Yanni Gourde’s goal in Game 7 vs. NYI last year’s semis.  The Lightning was shorthanded.  Yanni jumped off the bench while his replacement was at the center ice logo (coming off) and slipped in behind coverage and scored a short handed goal.  It was the only goal of the game. 

Call was not reviewable.  To be fair - the Isles did not score a goal in the game and no reasonable Isles fan will suggest that play was the sole reason the team lost.  It was not in OT like the Kadri goal.  You don’t score - you don’t deserve the win.

But that said - what if the goal was disallowed?  Who knows?

Below are some links if you are interested.  TB is running out of gas.  And I respect the HELL out of them, but the hockey gods giveth and they taketh away.

https://www.newsday.com/sports/hockey/islanders/islanders-lightning-game-7-shorthanded-goal-d66396

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10039641-lightnings-jon-cooper-heart-breaks-for-tb-players-a

Posted by Kaszycki and his Krew on 06/23/22 at 09:13 AM ET

SauceBoss's avatar

Also if you watch the replay, Tampa has 6 maybe 7 guys on the ice as well. The change didn’t result in an odd man rush or a breakaway. TB defense were out of position and got beat.

Don’t agree with Cooper’s comments either. They’ve gotten away with so much just in these last few years. It’s a bad look. Just shup up and take the L

Posted by SauceBoss on 06/23/22 at 09:20 AM ET

TreKronor's avatar

It was a missed call, no doubt.

“What-about-isms” be damned, it was a missed call.  He’s not wrong.

Posted by TreKronor on 06/23/22 at 09:45 AM ET

Rumbear's avatar

Not really sure how pointing out To Many Men on the ice is being a sore loser. Everybody said show me the video. So there it is. To Many Men. Rule is broken. Anything contrary is just chin wagging BS

Really sucks to lose when teams cheat. Nuff said.

Posted by Rumbear from Top O the Hasek, sing along The YzerMan Can!...... on 06/23/22 at 09:49 AM ET

Avatar

“What-about-isms” be damned, it was a missed call. 

And we can all agree that, not only was it the only missed call in the game, but also the only missed call in the playoffs.  And on top of that, it’s the first ever missed call in a hockey game.

Yes, it was terrible timing for the only missed call in the history of hockey to happen in OT during the 106th Stanley Cup Final.

Boo hoo is exactly right.

Posted by GMoney on 06/23/22 at 10:13 AM ET

Ataris18's avatar

I hate the Avs and wish zero success for them (but damn Makar looks phenomenal). Anyways is it a missed call? Ya probably. But how the heck does Tampa’s first goal count when a shot knocks off the goalies mask before bouncing to a player who has to corral it and then shoot it into an empty net?  “Immediate chance scoring” is a stupid statement if the goalie would have time to try to make a save.  Anytime the helmet isnt coming off when the puck is bouncing into the net on the follow up from the save should be stopped.  Is Darcy supposed to really try to make a save without his mask?  It sucks but i’d say (as normal) things even themselves out.

Posted by Ataris18 from House on 06/23/22 at 10:39 AM ET

Avatar

Just watched the Yanni Gourde game 7 goal against the Isles, and it wasn’t even comparable to this.  Gourde’s coming on for Killorn, who’s maybe 5 feet from the boards with his stick in the air and clearly on his way to the bench.  He’s certainly not at center ice, which is a laughable claim.  Gourde jumped on maybe a few tenths of a second too early, if that. 

Kadri jumps on literally 5 seconds before Mackinnon is off.  That’s an eternity in hockey.  Kadri’s goal not only shouldn’t have counted, but the Avs should’ve been called for Too Many Men.

The refs just plain missed it.  But it happens.  I’ve seen worse, just unfortunate for Tampa it happened in a must win OT game during the Finals.

Posted by Redbird19 on 06/23/22 at 01:04 PM ET

Avatar

Whatever one thinks about this missed call
or previous ones, one thing that’s more
annoying than a coach frustrated in the moment
is adults trying to mock him by typing out an imitation
of a noise someone makes when they’re crying.

It’s fair enough to say that officials miss a lot of calls
and usually if not always teams end up on both sides
of bad calls at crucial moments in the course of the playoffs.

Irrational or not something about Kadri just rubs me the wrong way.
Very good player. Just don’t like the personality.

Posted by lefty.30 on 06/23/22 at 02:58 PM ET

Kaszycki and his Krew's avatar

Redbird, in the Isles example - you state that Killorn is coming on for Gourde, who is the guy who is in the M decal on the ice coming in for?  Tampa should have had 4 not 5 skaters as they were shorthanded.  There are functionally 7 skaters + goalie of Tampa on ice - 2 of which are at the bench, but clearly 5 skaters - and Gourde is already in the offense zone, and the guy in the M would have had to be at center ice when Gourde entered the ice (link below to the picture in question) and was on the other side of the center ice line while Gourde is on the attack. 

This in my opinion was too many men.  For if we go according to your recap of this - then Kadri scored a good goal - and the Bolts were not shorthanded. 

GO AVS GO!

Posted by Kaszycki and his Krew on 06/23/22 at 08:04 PM ET

Kaszycki and his Krew's avatar

https://theathletic.com/3379510/2022/06/23/avalanche-lightning-too-many-men/

More on the Kadri goal by Michael Russo in the Athletic, reminds us that in Game 2 in last year’s semis - Tampa had 7 guys on the ice for a goal by Palat

Posted by Kaszycki and his Krew on 06/23/22 at 09:35 PM ET

Avatar

Kaszycki, Gourde came on for Killorn, a second before that the Tampa D-man also went off for a change.  I’m sure there’s a photo somewhere that shows 6 Tampa players with their skates on the ice, but that happens all the time along the boards during a line change, it’s normal, and not too many men.  Here’s a video of Gourde’s goal, pause it the 9 or 10 second mark to see Gourde come on for Killorn.  It’s nothing like Kadri and MacKinnons exchange.

https://youtu.be/_RxSEUDASAw

Posted by Redbird19 on 06/23/22 at 11:58 PM ET

Kaszycki and his Krew's avatar

Last comment, I don’t know how to post pix here, but there were 7 guys with skates on the ice for the Gourde, and 5 with skates on the ice that were 5 feet away.  (sans goalie)  and the issue here is that TB was SHORTHANDED and only allowed 4 skaters and that extra guy was way more than 5 feet away.  Tampa had 7 guys on the ice for the Palat goal which I posted earlier.  Hockey gods giveth to Tampa, and now they taketh away with the Kadri goal.

So, I am perfectly fine with Kadri’s goal being allowed as it likely did not impact the play and hoping COL can finish the job tonight!  I really like Jon Cooper and Tampa and think that they have more than proven themselves as a G R E A T team.  A tough way to lose, but I don’t feel sorry for them.

Posted by Kaszycki and his Krew on 06/24/22 at 09:09 AM ET

Avatar

You’ll get no argument from me about Palat’s goal vs the Isles in game 1 (I believe), it shouldn’t have counted either.  But at least that was just 2 D-men coming on for 1 going off behind the play.  Here, Kadri joins the play at full speed and receives the pass in the O zone while MacKinnon is still coming off.  It’s crazy.  I agree though, stuff happens, and I’ve seen worse blown calls. 

But I also wanted to highlight what seems like a misunderstanding of the Too Many Men rule, since some folks are trying to brush this off, and even claiming Tampa had too many men during the Kadri goal as well because they had 2 guys with skates on the ice at their bench who were coming off in addition to the 5 skaters on the ice.  Literally every line change in every game sees the player coming on and the player coming off have their skates on the ice at the same time.  The boards along the bench is the gray where this is allowed as long as it’s clear 1 guy is going off and the other is replacing him, and neither attempt to play the puck while the exchange is occurring.  It’s left to the refs discretion to determine if they feel a guy came on too early, and want to blow the play dead for an illegal change (no penalty), or call a too many men penalty.  But Kadri and MacKinnon’s exchange was about as egregious as they come.

Posted by Redbird19 on 06/24/22 at 09:39 AM ET

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Paul Kukla founded Kukla’s Korner in 2005 and the site has since become the must-read site on the ‘net for all the latest happenings around the NHL.

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