Kukla's Korner

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Puck Stops Here Update

Some of you may have noticed over the last few days The Puck Stops Here has been posting via the KK Members Blog instead of the Puck Stops Here blog.

A few issues had been brought to my attention that I felt needed to be addressed.  I should have waited a day when making my initial decision of no more blogging on KK for TPSH.

After all, TPSH has been blogging since February 2005, has a faithful audience and does discuss hockey.

So as of today the blog will once again surface.  But there is one change that I think will allow the blog to move forward.

I will be controlling the deletion of comments, no one else, just me.

If you know my history, I am pretty lenient, some say too lenient, but I try to give the person making the comment the benefit of the doubt.

I am going to leave you with a statement from TPSH, one I mostly agree with…

“My view has been that commenting is a privelage.  You earn the privelage by advancing the conversation.  If you want to say my post is (fill in the blank) you do it by explaining why in a way that advances the conversation.  Just throwing out a oneliner does nothing to advance anything.  It is a waste.”

Filed in: KK Website Business, | KK Hockey | Permalink
 

Comments

J.J. from Kansas's avatar

As somebody who has had many comments by TPSH deleted, I wholeheartedly endorse this move. TPSH does have some interesting things to say about a variety of hockey topics, but has been completely irresponsible with the way he has handled comments and often has used them to censor opinions he does not like. 

I’ll respond to his claim that commenting is a privilege with a reminder that having your very own blog on a high-traffic website is also a privilege.

I’d also counter the idea that you can’t advance the conversation in a meaningful way by using only one sentence. A one-liner is an invitation for discussion.  When a blogger calls out another blogger after either mistakenly or intentionally misreading what he said and then deletes comments which aim to discuss that portion of his writing, it is not a meaningless waste. Deleting comments like that is censorship and, more to the point, it is childish. It is not a case of advancing the conversation, it is a case of a person trying to prevent the conversation from advancing down a course he does not like.

Here’s to the forwarding of discussion, even that which may be critical of that which is critical.

Posted by J.J. from Kansas on 05/30/12 at 11:03 AM ET

Luongo-is-my-hero's avatar

Ok, now i understand why my filter was not working earlier. Thanks for the update Paul

Posted by Luongo-is-my-hero on 05/30/12 at 11:11 AM ET

Paul's avatar

Limh, Some people are having issues with the fliter while others have no issues..  But it will be corrected with the major software upgrade in late June.

Posted by Paul from Motown Area on 05/30/12 at 11:13 AM ET

Primis's avatar

Commenting on a publicly-posted article or post is NOT a “privilege”.  Being able to post such an article publicly in a place like KK *is*.

Perhaps TPSH would be better off posting his articles only to himself, so that he can ensure himself that nobody will ever disagree with him?  A public forum and discussion seems to be the exact opposite of what he’s trying to accomplish…

Posted by Primis on 05/30/12 at 11:23 AM ET

Paul's avatar

Primis, TPSH has no issues with people disagreeing with him as long as the comment continues the hockey discussion.

By deciding that I handle the comments, I truly believe the blog will move forward and I take full responsibility by not making that decision earlier.

Posted by Paul from Motown Area on 05/30/12 at 11:28 AM ET

J.J. from Kansas's avatar

Primis, TPSH has no issues with people disagreeing with him as long as the comment continues the hockey discussion.

I don’t agree with this. Having had comments deleted which were aimed at either clarifying or criticizing TPSH’s conclusions drawn from a subject he has read or analyzed, I don’t believe he gets the benefit of the doubt about having no issues with people disagreeing with him.

The author’s biases are a part of the hockey discussion on any given article and that has been the way KK members have been allowed to discuss things around here, whether it be an article penned by Tony Gallagher or TPSH himself.

I understand that personal attacks against the author are off-limits because they really don’t further the discussion. Like I said though, I look forward to this widened scope about what does and does not count as continuing the discussion.

Posted by J.J. from Kansas on 05/30/12 at 11:57 AM ET

Paul's avatar

J.J. that is one of the reasons why I will be controlling the comments.  Most of you should know by now what and what I don’t allow, so if those guidelines are met, there will no longer by any comment issues.

Posted by Paul from Motown Area on 05/30/12 at 12:00 PM ET

awould's avatar

I believe this is a step in the right direction. I do not typically read most of his posts because I find it lacks what I like. There are some posts that catch my attention though. I have had my share of comments deleted, some for ridiculous reasons and probably a couple for legitimate reasons after I got annoyed with legitimate posts disappearing. But that is in the past now.

While I rarely agree with anything posted by TPSH, I do like statistics and find great value in the comments made by the knowledgeable KK members. So, for me, TPSH may now serve as a jumping off point for something useful, instead of a blog post that exists just to be right, which is how I’ve come to view it in recent months.

Paul, I believe that you will rarely find cause to delete a comment because most do advance the conversation even if they lack perfect decorum.

And now we can all be free to discuss which is the latest particular player or team that is not elite.

Posted by awould on 05/30/12 at 01:29 PM ET

redxblack's avatar

I have had comments deleted that carried the conversation along and/or pointed out fallacies in the analysis. TPSH is not an honest arbiter of the delete key. I’d point to evidence, but it has been deleted. I try to block his blog since he is not interested in real conversation, but it does not block for me. I appreciate and applaud this change.

Posted by redxblack from Akron Ohio on 05/30/12 at 01:47 PM ET

dougie's avatar

I should have waited a day when making my initial decision of no more blogging on KK for TPSH.

Or not. Trust your gut, Paul. First thought is often the best thought.wink

Posted by dougie on 05/30/12 at 03:55 PM ET

bezukov's avatar

I’m not a big reader of TPSH’s content.  Consequently my interaction with him has been limited.  However, it does frustrate me to hear about people having their opinions stymied on an arbitrary basis.  Whether or not a comment “advances the discussion” or constitutes “hockey talk” sounds like a moving target to me. 

In my humble opinion I wouldn’t want to see a comment deleted unless its trolling, personal, or hate speech.  I’ve been around long enough to know that the primary victims of TPSH aren’t those types.  I hold myself to a certain standard as a run of the mill member, but I feel a blogger needs to be much better than that.  I’ve seen TPSH troll on A2Y on top of the deleting of comments.  A blogger should be better.

Posted by bezukov from the kids are alright. on 05/30/12 at 05:23 PM ET

Avatar

I thought his negative blog about Dale Hunter and his coaching was way off base.

Posted by bert07 on 05/30/12 at 05:48 PM ET

NHLJeff's avatar

I have also been a deletion victim. He completely misread my comment that I considered a compliment to him and deleted it. Since then, I’ve tried to refrain from commenting on his blogs (and I’ve rarely been reading them unless it’s something that really interests me).

Posted by NHLJeff from Pens fan in Chicago, IL on 05/30/12 at 06:39 PM ET

Avatar

I just stopped clicking on his blog to avoid the drama. There never seemed to be a conversation, just these are the facts as I interpret them and there can be no dissent. I may now considering reading it once again to see what others think.

Posted by hockey1919 from mid-atlantic on 05/30/12 at 06:52 PM ET

Luongo-is-my-hero's avatar

is it fair to say that tpsh is the only one who gets blocked off peoples list

Posted by Luongo-is-my-hero on 05/31/12 at 01:31 AM ET

Paul's avatar

Nope Limh, Most of the blogs have at least a few people who block them.

Posted by Paul from Motown Area on 05/31/12 at 01:33 AM ET

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Paul Kukla founded Kukla’s Korner in 2005 and the site has since become the must-read site on the ‘net for all the latest happenings around the NHL.

From breaking news to in-depth stories around the league, KK Hockey is updated with fresh stories all day long and will bring you the latest news as quickly as possible.

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