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Pittsburgh, the logical choice for Parise and Suter?

If Pittsburgh wasn’t already doing a hard sell on Zach Parise and Ryan Suter’s agents, Yahoo Sports’ Nicholas J. Cotsonika just penned one for ‘em, imagining what Cotsonika called a dynasty-in-the-making team truly evolving into just that with this summer’s marquee free agents choosing what he seems to believe is the only logical place for either to play:

If you’re Zach Parise or Ryan Suter, is there anywhere you’d rather play than Pittsburgh? The Penguins can take a run at the top two UFAs on the market, Zach Parise and Ryan Suter. (Getty)Let’s see. You could be paid well. If you’re Parise, you could be the long-awaited winger for Sidney Crosby, who just so happens to be your buddy. If you’re Suter, you could bolster the defense of a talented team that includes Crosby, Evgeni Malkin, James Neal, Kris Letang and Marc-Andre Fleury. In either case, you could work for good-guy coach Dan Bylsma. You could have a great chance to win the Stanley Cup year in and year out.

Oh, and you could do it all in a U.S. market where hockey matters but doesn’t matter too much – important for low-key American stars like Parise, from Minnesota, and Suter, from Wisconsin.

Parise and Suter didn’t seem like realistic options for Pittsburgh a couple of days ago. But now that general manager Ray Shero has cleared salary-cap space by swinging deals at the NHL draft at Consol Energy Center, the Penguins can make a push for at least one of the top unrestricted free agents July 1. Especially if Shero can clear some more space – by, say, moving defenseman Paul Martin and his $5 million hit – they might even be able to make a push for both.

But what about other teams, like Detroit or Minnesota?

Both could go to Detroit or Minnesota. The Red Wings have the cap space to make a splash, and their savvy management has been able to reload for years without high draft picks. They especially need Suter after the departures of Nicklas Lidstrom and Brad Stuart. The Wild has cap space and Midwestern allure. Minneapolis is Parise’s hometown team and close to Suter’s home state. But some of the Wings’ key pieces are older. How long can they defy gravity? And is the Wild close enough to winning? Does anyone know if the Wild can win long-term?

Both should have other options. Parise could go to, say, Los Angeles. The Kings have cap space and a hole at left wing. They just beat the Devils to win the Cup, and they have a young core. The beach ain’t bad, either. But is he a West Coast guy? Suter could go to, say, Chicago, if the Blackhawks can clear cap space by trading Niklas Hjalmarsson and his $3.5 million hit.

No doubt others will be in the mix, or will want to be, and Pittsburgh isn’t necessarily perfect. Some teams might be willing to pay more money or do a front-loaded deal – perhaps especially Detroit, with owner Mike Ilitch aggressively trying to keep the Wings among the elite. Parise or Suter – or both – might have to take less to fit into the Penguins’ salary structure, and the Pens won’t do front-loaded deals, even with a potential lockout looming.

He goes on at some length, and it’s written like a love letter.

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Comments

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Avatar

I should have known you wouldn’t understand.

Yeah, you’re stupid.

I agree with the dumbass who keeps changing his arguments and inferring things that weren’t implied.

Posted by Garth on 06/24/12 at 04:08 AM ET

J.J. from Kansas's avatar

I’ve spent the last hours saying the system is broken and lowering the cap floor percentile won’t solve it

That’s because we’re arguing in favor of ESTABLISHING the cap floor percentile, since it’s currently not set as a percent, but as a fixed amount.  The cap floor next year will be 77% of the ceiling.  That is dumb.

Posted by J.J. from Kansas on 06/24/12 at 04:08 AM ET

Avatar

Posted by Oz_Santwyk from Perth Australia on 06/24/12 at 02:07 AM ET

Then you understand that the difference between cap and ceiling is FIXED AT $16M AND NOT A PERCENTAGE OF THE CAP.  We are advocating that the ceiling be A PERCENTAGE OF THE CAP, NOT A FIXED DOLLAR AMOUNT OF DIFFERENCE.

Posted by Garth on 06/24/12 at 04:09 AM ET

J.J. from Kansas's avatar

Posted by Oz_Santwyk from Perth Australia on 06/24/12 at 02:07 AM ET

Wait a cocksucking minute… did you just quote WIKIPEDIA at me in response to a quote from the actual NHL CBA?

Redux time:

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHHAHAAAAA oh man HAHAHAHHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAHHAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAHAHA

[breath]

HAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAHAHHAHAHAHAAHHHAH

HAHAHAAHHHHAHAHAHAH

Posted by J.J. from Kansas on 06/24/12 at 04:10 AM ET

Oz_Santwyk's avatar

wow i hope you guys are drunk or from alberta, because seriously if you re-read everything you will look pretty foolish right now.

Hockeytown I think you are the only one to comprehend what I’ve been saying and that’s sad, because usually this is a pretty intelligent group of guys.

Posted by Oz_Santwyk from Perth Australia on 06/24/12 at 04:10 AM ET

HockeytownOverhaul's avatar

Posted by Oz_Santwyk from Perth Australia on 06/24/12 at 02:05 AM ET

o.0

That’s not what I’m saying at all.  I’d be wasting my time explaining it but you clearly don’t understand the point of the floor and cap limit, and you don’t understand how teams individually make their money, e.i. the owners.  I’m not even sure you watch hockey to be honest with you, nothing you’ve said demonstrates you follow the sport aside from some random grandstanding making up shit

Posted by HockeytownOverhaul on 06/24/12 at 04:10 AM ET

J.J. from Kansas's avatar

Posted by Oz_Santwyk from Perth Australia on 06/24/12 at 02:10 AM ET

By the way, your time is up on explaining that you know anything about the CBA.

Thanks for playing.

Posted by J.J. from Kansas on 06/24/12 at 04:11 AM ET

Oz_Santwyk's avatar

You do realize that amendments have been made to the CBA and thus the one you have there is not the original just the most current.

Also it doesn’t matter if you change it from a fixed dollar amount of a percentage of revenues, it’s still a flawed system. As i’ve been saying all night, when the league revenues continue to grow with teams losing money, doing a one time percentage lowering or fixed amount lowering will only help for one year. Because when the revenues continue to grow that percentage will turn into a dollar figure for the cap and if the poor teams can’t afford that number then what? you are in the same position as you are now.

Posted by Oz_Santwyk from Perth Australia on 06/24/12 at 04:15 AM ET

HockeytownOverhaul's avatar

lmao, mostly is tonight too wink

I fuchin’ love this guy, I’m seriously busting a gut smilesmile:)

Posted by HockeytownOverhaul on 06/24/12 at 04:15 AM ET

HockeytownOverhaul's avatar

Posted by Oz_Santwyk from Perth Australia on 06/24/12 at 02:15 AM ET

Are you saying the cap ceiling shouldn’t raise?  If the NHL is recording record profits you don’t think the players deserve a share of the profits int heir salaries?

Posted by HockeytownOverhaul on 06/24/12 at 04:17 AM ET

J.J. from Kansas's avatar

You do realize that amendments have been made to the CBA and thus the one you have there is not the original just the most current.

You do realize that the CBA has a change summary which clearly outlines every change that has been made to the CBA, right?

Now you’re flat-out lying about things and that is sad for you.

when the league revenues continue to grow with teams losing money

Why are teams losing money though?  Maybe it has to do with spending up to 65% of their individual revenues to meet the salary floor?

Why wouldn’t they be able to make money if you lowered their costs?  The Maple Leafs don’t spend 65% of their revenues on player salaries and they make money.

Posted by J.J. from Kansas on 06/24/12 at 04:19 AM ET

awould's avatar

Posted by Oz_Santwyk from Perth Australia on 06/24/12 at 02:15 AM ET

I have no dog in this fight about the CBA, been mildly amused reading all of this. I can say, however, that you are not making any sense. You’ve contradicted yourself numerous times and have routinely taken these other guys’ words out of context (or thin air).

it isn’t hard to understand the effect it would have of changing the structure of the CBA from a fixed difference to a percentage difference. Yet somehow you’ve managed to not understand it.

From your arguments, i can surmise that you believe the current system sucks, that you’re not sure what the current system is, that you think a %-based system would be no different and that maybe you actually don’t want a cap floor at all. I’m really not sure what the hell you are talking about anymore….

goodnight. go wings. fleury sucks.

Posted by awould on 06/24/12 at 04:21 AM ET

George Malik's avatar

Friends, we’re at a hundred and thirty comments here, and something tells me that you’re not all engaging in polite discourse about the aesthetic value of $500,000-plus homes in Southeastern Michigan as opposed to Southwestern Pennsylvania…

If you’re going to keep arguing for the sake of arguing, and if you’re going to continue to make this personal, it is entirely possible that you will find this entry’s ability to take comments disappear.

This article was posted at 7:26 PM EDT and it’s 2:21 AM EDT as I’m writing this. If you don’t feel you’ve successfully made your point by now, I’m afraid that you might be preaching to a lost cause.

Posted by George Malik from South Lyon, MI on 06/24/12 at 04:21 AM ET

Oz_Santwyk's avatar

When did I say that and what did i say that ever could be used to infer i did. I said your plans will not work. I also said no plans will work unless all revenues are equally shared between the teams or you get rid of the poor markets and bring in financially viable ones. Like I said can’t slap a band aid on a severed torso and expect it to live.

Posted by Oz_Santwyk from Perth Australia on 06/24/12 at 04:22 AM ET

HockeytownOverhaul's avatar

Man, I actually thought, as “heated” as the exchange has seemed, I only saw 1 “Aussies are dumb” comment… I did throw in a college boy comment but I also threw myself under the bus admitting to a public education wink

Posted by HockeytownOverhaul on 06/24/12 at 04:25 AM ET

Oz_Santwyk's avatar

Yes no need to remove the rights to post it’s all in fun and quite entertaining for all involved otherwise we wouldn’t continue it.

Posted by Oz_Santwyk from Perth Australia on 06/24/12 at 04:26 AM ET

J.J. from Kansas's avatar

I also said no plans will work unless all revenues are equally shared between the teams

If you had started off by saying that, we could have just written you off as a crackpot and gone our separate ways.

Posted by J.J. from Kansas on 06/24/12 at 04:26 AM ET

Oz_Santwyk's avatar

It’s patently obvious that neither side understands what the other is trying to say or one or both are completely wrong. But that’s what makes a good politician so I personally think we should all run for office.

Posted by Oz_Santwyk from Perth Australia on 06/24/12 at 04:28 AM ET

J.J. from Kansas's avatar

Since moving to the States, I have spent most of my free time either reading, talking or watching hockey, it has become my life’s passion.

Written September, 2007

LOL

Posted by J.J. from Kansas on 06/24/12 at 04:28 AM ET

J.J. from Kansas's avatar

I understand perfectly what the other side is saying. I just think it’s ridiculous.

Posted by J.J. from Kansas on 06/24/12 at 04:30 AM ET

Oz_Santwyk's avatar

In business there is no such thing as a perfect system. However, propping up failing markets is what lowering the floor is doing and that still won’t work because they are not ever going to make enough money to be competitive and if you are competitive you don’t draw crowds and fans and without fans you are bust. Put another team in toronto, and quebec remove the devils, CBJ, florida and their like and lets get down to the Pens taking suter and parise from under the wings nose and sending them back to the deadwings days, while the pens drink from lord stanley’s cup!

Posted by Oz_Santwyk from Perth Australia on 06/24/12 at 04:31 AM ET

Oz_Santwyk's avatar

Holy digging that blog out of the doldrums. That was my first move into hockey blogging and I found myself not having enough time to dedicate to it. Ahh the trip down memory lane.

Posted by Oz_Santwyk from Perth Australia on 06/24/12 at 04:35 AM ET

J.J. from Kansas's avatar

Put another team in toronto, and quebec remove the devils, CBJ, florida and their like

I just want to make clear I know how many teams you’re talking about just eliminating from existence.

Because those teams will make FAR less money and be WAY less competitive than a team that’s not forced to spend $54M on player salaries and therefore may not be as competitive as the Flyers, Red Wings, Canucks, Blackhawks, Kings, Predators, Blues, Penguins, Devils, Rangers, Senators, Capitals, Sharks, or Bruins.

I also want to know exactly how many NHL jobs you’d throw out the window to bring along this revenue-sharing utopia where every team is gray-on-gray for fun.

Posted by J.J. from Kansas on 06/24/12 at 04:38 AM ET

tkfergy's avatar

If you need to know more about the history of the NHL cba i suggest you can wikipedia it where you’ll find this little tidbit

The CBA also contains a “Lower Limit of the Payroll Range”, which is the minimum that each team must pay in player salaries. The lower limit was originally set at 55% of the cap, but is now defined to be $16 million below the cap; therefore the 2011–12 minimum is $48.3 million.

Posted by Oz_Santwyk from Perth Australia on 06/24/12 at 02:07 AM ET

here is your problem for the whole argument, read the CBA. wikipedia is not credible because anyone can edit it, that’s why you are not allowed to source it on any work that is considered credible. if it was always at 55% there probably would need to be a new CBA as the old one would still be working for the most part.

Posted by tkfergy on 06/24/12 at 04:39 AM ET

Oz_Santwyk's avatar

Actually in all seriousness, I’d relocate Yotes and florida to quebec and toronto and see what happens. Both teams even with good playoffs year don’t draw.

Posted by Oz_Santwyk from Perth Australia on 06/24/12 at 04:44 AM ET

DrewBehr's avatar

... No, MY dick is bigger!

Posted by DrewBehr from The Mitten on 06/24/12 at 04:50 AM ET

Oz_Santwyk's avatar

I don’t need to read the CBA already have I also know it was set at 55% and subsequently changed. The CBA has had many small revisions since it was introduced. Which is quite normal over the course of a CBA term. As long as both parties agree to the changes they will be ratified. Or are you trying to tell me the CBA has not been altered since it was introduced in 2005?

Posted by Oz_Santwyk from Perth Australia on 06/24/12 at 04:52 AM ET

tkfergy's avatar

Posted by Oz_Santwyk from Perth Australia on 06/24/12 at 02:52 AM ET

not at all because the first year was 55% but every subsequent year was $16 mil. What I’m saying is if you are trying to prove a point don’t quote wikipedia. if you don’t believe me this is a quote from wikipedia about wikipedia

Wikipedia is not considered a credible source. Wikipedia is increasingly used by people in the academic community, from freshman students to professors, as an easily accessible tertiary source for information about anything and everything. However, citation of Wikipedia in research papers may be considered unacceptable, because Wikipedia is not considered a credible or authoritative source.[1][2]
This is especially true considering anyone can edit the information given at any time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Academic_use

Posted by tkfergy on 06/24/12 at 04:58 AM ET

Oz_Santwyk's avatar

I’ll take your avoidance of the question says it all.

Wikipedia may not be a trusted source but it confirmed something I already had in my memory. So If it was in my mind and then i find it there too it would pretty much suggest it’s what was the case.

But again you won’t admit there have been changes, when there is tons of reports in the media about changes including one involving Kovalchuk for one. So this conversation is officially over.

Peace out!

Posted by Oz_Santwyk from Perth Australia on 06/24/12 at 05:05 AM ET

tkfergy's avatar

Posted by Oz_Santwyk from Perth Australia on 06/24/12 at 03:05 AM ET

yes there have been changes, but the change you are referring to happened for the 06-07 year, so yes it was originally a good idea then became a bad one less than one year later.

Posted by tkfergy on 06/24/12 at 05:16 AM ET

Joe Z.'s avatar

boys, chill down, you’re worse than some 80year olds talking politics. the cba is all about money, and hockey teams in deserts or hockey-unfriendly environments will always struggle, because nobody cares about hockey when it’s over 30°C outside. actually you’re arguing if a fart is smelling bad.

Posted by Joe Z. from Austria on 06/24/12 at 09:17 AM ET

Avatar

i understand why detroit fans are so touch over all this.  Their next season banks on the fact they can sign the top two free agents.  If they can’t their in serious trouble.  I’d be nervous over all of this also. 

For an organization that is all about building talent within; that seems a bit odd to me but go for it.  I’m don’t the Penguins or Red Wings will end up with either Suter or Parise.  The Penguins will still be in much better shape than the Red Wings if that occurs.

Posted by tbassett on 06/24/12 at 09:39 AM ET

J.J. from Kansas's avatar

Wikipedia may not be a trusted source but it confirmed something I already had in my memory.

If Wikipedia led you to believe the floor was set deliberately at 55% instead of how it was actually set according to the CBA, then Wikipedia lied to you and that is more evidence as to why it is not considered a credible source. There is a change summary. Find me the letter signed by the league and NHLPA which changes the wording from 55% to $16M, as that is the only way to amend the CBA.

hockey teams in deserts or hockey-unfriendly environments will always struggle, because nobody cares about hockey when it’s over 30°C outside.

You mean like the Stanley Cup Champion Dallas Stars, Anaheim Ducks, and Los Angeles Kings?

Posted by J.J. from Kansas on 06/24/12 at 10:49 AM ET

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Paul Kukla founded Kukla’s Korner in 2005 and the site has since become the must-read site on the ‘net for all the latest happenings around the NHL.

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