Kukla's Korner

Kukla's Korner Hockey

Evening Line

 

 

Filed in: NHL Teams, New York Rangers, NHL Talk, NHLPA, | KK Hockey | Permalink
  Tags: henrik+lundqvist

Comments

Avatar

I guess much of the same could be said about bringing in the third and fourth liners…or the fringe players…

Find and dandy to have the stars of the league have thir say.  But the thrid and fourth liners, the guys that grind in the corners…when they have something to say against the process- they get a call from the PA henchmen…pure jokes.

Posted by Adanac on 11/30/12 at 07:41 PM ET

J.J. from Kansas's avatar

But the thrid and fourth liners, the guys that grind in the corners…when they have something to say against the process- they get a call from the PA henchmen…pure jokes.

The PA has constantly said that players who want to be involved will be welcome to and will have their travel covered from the NHLPA war fund. The players who have spoken out (Hamrlik and Neuvirth, most-recently) have taken those shots from Europe without an actual attempt to join the negotiations.

I think that part of what Lundqvist is getting at is that he’d like his own owner, James Dolan to have a bit more power in the room. Dolan might be the most anti-lockout, anti-Bettman owner in the league (as he’s the only person who’s still a governor after having filed an antitrust lawsuit against the league).

Just speculation on my part though.

Posted by J.J. from Kansas on 11/30/12 at 07:51 PM ET

henrymalredo's avatar

Some of the most vocal PA guys have been guys like Cleary, Backes, Westgrath.  Not fringe players by any means, but they are certainly not superstars.  Honestly, it seems like the NHL’s middle-tier players have been the most vocal PA supporters.

Posted by henrymalredo from Lansing on 11/30/12 at 08:41 PM ET

perfection's avatar

i’m with you JJ. I’d think the owners of the Rangers, the Leafs, the Wings, etc. should be extremely unhappy with the current state of negotiations. It must sting a bit when a chunk of the owners actually MAKE money by locking out the players and shelving NHL hockey, while a team like the Leafs are losing many millions of dollars a day. And speaking of Dolan, isn’t he also the one who tried to get Bettman fired a few years ago? There’s definitely an argument to be made that the franchises who literally are carrying the league should have the most say in how they support their parasitic brethren. Especially when the only negotiating tactic is a lockout that bleeds these successful franchises while simply letting the losing franchises off the hook from the debts they’d be accruing by having a season.

Posted by perfection from LaLaLand on 11/30/12 at 11:12 PM ET

Avatar

There’s definitely an argument to be made that the franchises who literally are carrying the league should have the most say in how they support their parasitic brethren

.

Good luck with a league made of money making franchises under the current CBA. If Dolan and the Leafs want to fork over real revenue sharing, then they are welcome to the party.

Posted by timbits on 12/01/12 at 01:17 AM ET

Avatar

And speaking of Dolan, isn’t he also the one who tried to get Bettman fired a few years ago?

I don’t know about that, but I do know Dolan’s sued him at least once over some trivial thing (think he didn’t like the NHL’s webdesign).

Find and dandy to have the stars of the league have thir say.  But the thrid and fourth liners, the guys that grind in the corners…when they have something to say against the process- they get a call from the PA henchmen…pure jokes.

Posted by Adanac on 11/30/12 at 06:41 PM ET

Goodenow used to do that, but Fehr doesn’t seem to. At least, the admonishments PA members have made against Hamrlik and Neuvirth don’t strike me as the sort of thing a lawyer would have cooked up.

Posted by larry on 12/01/12 at 02:42 AM ET

Avatar

The problem here always comes back to the basic realities of the NHL’s financial structure:

1) As long as Bettman is dead-set behind the idea of driving hockey into non-traditional markets he’s going to have a league with 5-10 franchises that will always struggle to survive financially.

2) As long as there are 5-10 franchises that always struggle to survive financially, he has to have a CBA that makes it as easy as possible for those 5-10 teams to survive financially, which means the lowest possible player share and most possible drafted player protection for teams.

3) In order to get that kind of CBA he has to have the support of the big market teams who actually carry the leagues, so he can’t do the 50-60% revenue share tax of the profitable teams it would require to get the 5-10 financially awful clubs up to a point of viability.  Which leaves…

4) Crushing the players.  Which means…

5) There are always lockouts because the players don’t want to be crushed.

It doesn’t really matter which players are involved, because it’s not like the PA is ever stupid enough to put any of the NHL’s deals up to a full vote.  The negotiating committee will have some token non-stars on it, but I don’t think anyone really believes an agreement would be allowed to be voted on without the NHL’s talent illuminati approving it in advance.

Posted by HockeyinHD on 12/01/12 at 07:56 AM ET

J.J. from Kansas's avatar

I don’t know about that, but I do know Dolan’s sued him at least once over some trivial thing (think he didn’t like the NHL’s webdesign).

Dolan led a vote in 2009 to have Bettman removed as commissioner.

This was on the tail end of problems from 2007. It wasn’t just that MSG didn’t like the web design of the NHL, it’s that MSG had their own web branding strategy which worked incredibly well for them. The Rangers and Knicks already had a thriving online community that liked their site design. When the NHL said that all 30 teams’ websites had to look the same, the Rangers balked at the idea.

The situation got so bad that the Rangers filed an antitrust suit against the league and Dolan called the NHL an “Illegal cartel”.  The NHL countered by filing to have their bylaws upheld in the situation. The league eventually moved on to the legal process of forcing Dolan out (the NHL constitution gives the league the power to vote an owner out by forcing him to sell.)

In the end, the matter was settled out of court. While the specific details have not been made public, there are a few things that have generally been reported to have come out of the agreement.

1. The case was dismissed with prejudice based on the agreement (Barring the Rangers from ever re-opening this specific antitrust case against the league)
2. The NHL (obviously) got their way on the website design issue
3. BoG votes can now be held on a secret ballot.
4. Ownership groups can delay a vote called for by the NHL by 30 days.
5. The Rangers paid all of the league’s legal fees

Essentially, the league won and they won pretty big. This all wrapped up just before Jerry Moyes filed for Bankruptcy and continued the process that would end in him being prevented from selling the team to Jim Balsillie and eventually being forced to sell the club to the league for significantly less. (Although, Moyes ran that club into the ground and then stopped giving a shit about them. The league had been running the club for a while before that and his end-around attempt to sell to Balsillie was an absolute shit move by Moyes).

The collective result of all of this is that the league probably feels incredibly comfortable in engaging in activities that would otherwise seem to be that of a cartel. The Rangers capitulated because (speculation) they simply didn’t want to risk that the NHL’s homeowners’-association-on-steroids rules would be upheld and they’d be forced out of the Rangers’ money-printing business.

The league has faced outright dissension in the ranks two times since the last lockout and have absolutely crushed it. They’ve pretty much proven that if they’re going to get their hand slapped for being too monopolistic, it’s going to have to come from the outside.

Posted by J.J. from Kansas on 12/01/12 at 10:04 AM ET

Red Winger's avatar

The PA has constantly said that players who want to be involved

...if they can pull themselves away from Twitter, where asinine comments and death threats seem to be a favorite hobby for the bored players.

Bettman’s an ass, that’s a given; but the players have done nothing to ingratiate themselves to the public during this ugly process.

Posted by Red Winger from Sault Ste Marie on 12/01/12 at 12:14 PM ET

J.J. from Kansas's avatar

People who judge large groups based on the actions of a vocal minority make us all look bad…to those specific people, that is.

Posted by J.J. from Kansas on 12/01/12 at 12:51 PM ET

Avatar

...if they can pull themselves away from Twitter, where asinine comments and death threats seem to be a favorite hobby for the bored players.

Yeah, because I simply can’t turn around without being inundated by a small number of players occasionally posting something…

Posted by Garth on 12/01/12 at 01:54 PM ET

Avatar

Posted by J.J. from Kansas on 12/01/12 at 09:04 AM ET

Interesting stuff.

Glad to see that one of its members and its lawyers admits that the NHL is, by nature, a cartel. I’ve been called a “moron” in the past for saying the same thing.

Posted by larry on 12/01/12 at 03:20 PM ET

Avatar

People who judge large groups based on the actions of a vocal minority

... may be right.

Posted by HockeyinHD on 12/02/12 at 08:55 AM ET

J.J. from Kansas's avatar

Fortunately, the intellectual laziness it takes to conflate things to that degree in the first place also works to prevent the kind of rational thought it takes to overcome it.

Posted by J.J. from Kansas on 12/02/12 at 11:08 AM ET

Add a Comment

Please limit embedded image or media size to 575 pixels wide.

Add your own avatar by joining Kukla's Korner, or logging in and uploading one in your member control panel.

Captchas bug you? Join KK or log in and you won't have to bother.

Smileys

Notify me of follow-up comments?

Feed

Most Recent Blog Posts

About Kukla's Korner Hockey

Paul Kukla founded Kukla’s Korner in 2005 and the site has since become the must-read site on the ‘net for all the latest happenings around the NHL.

From breaking news to in-depth stories around the league, KK Hockey is updated with fresh stories all day long and will bring you the latest news as quickly as possible.

Email Paul anytime at pk@kuklaskorner.com

 

image

image