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Cammalleri Discusses NHL Negotiation Tactics

from Jonas Siegel of TSN,

Mike Cammalleri was one of 100 or so NHL players on a conference call with the players association earlier this week, consensus largely shared amongst the participants.

"What can I tell you, guys unanimously feel the same way about it and the feeling guys are saying is they've offered us nothing," said the Flames winger, following an hour-long workout with a group of peers at a midtown Toronto rink. "It just really feels like a shakedown for the players. That's kind of the feeling across the board."...

"It's disappointing that the approach for Gary [Bettman] and the ownership group has been to make these hard dates and final offers and not budging and on and on," said Cammalleri. "There's no real answer to why except 'We think we can lock you out and your careers are short and we can shake you down'. Not a good feeling."

read on

Filed in: NHL Teams, Calgary Flames, NHL Talk, NHLPA, | KK Hockey | Permalink
  Tags: mike+cammalleri

Comments

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Camo did manage to not say anything spectacularly stupid, but the “What can I tell you, guys unanimously feel the same way about it and the feeling guys are saying is they’ve offered us nothing,” shows a pretty significant absence of common sense.

If he thinks the NHL wasn’t budging before, though… he may be in for a bit of a readjustment of his previous standards.

Posted by HockeyinHD on 10/25/12 at 05:27 PM ET

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Camo did manage to not say anything spectacularly stupid, but the “What can I tell you, guys unanimously feel the same way about it and the feeling guys are saying is they’ve offered us nothing,” shows a pretty significant absence of common sense.

I know, because the NHL did offer them something.  A bullshit deal that should be the basis for negotiation rather than a hardline, final offer.

Posted by Garth on 10/25/12 at 06:06 PM ET

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I know, because the NHL did offer them something.  A bullshit deal that should be the basis for negotiation rather than a hardline, final offer.

Eyeroll.

Posted by HockeyinHD on 10/25/12 at 07:25 PM ET

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Eyeroll.

Well said.

Posted by Garth on 10/25/12 at 08:48 PM ET

redxblack's avatar

I’ve been in lock step with Garth on all his comments on this issue. You really do get it. I wonder how many here have ever participated in a CBA negotiation?

Posted by redxblack from Akron Ohio on 10/25/12 at 09:23 PM ET

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Well said.

Why thank you!

Posted by HockeyinHD on 10/26/12 at 04:15 AM ET

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I’ve been in lock step with Garth on all his comments on this issue. You really do get it. I wonder how many here have ever participated in a CBA negotiation?

Based on the comments, in general I would say that there are maybe two or three people who have participated in this thread who have ever actively negotiated for anything, ever.

Posted by HockeyinHD on 10/26/12 at 04:16 AM ET

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Based on your HD comments I’ve got to get that at some time your salary was at “Point A” and you’re trying to convince yourself that you did the right thing because soon…very soon, you hope…your salary will eventually be up to that level soon, at which point you can proclaim that you never took a salary cut at all.

Posted by Garth on 10/26/12 at 07:03 AM ET

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two or three people who have participated in this thread who have ever actively negotiated for anything, ever.

Are you counting yourself in this number?

Cammalleri is right, so far there has been an offer to cut HRR no matter how defined, extend the age and years of service to free agency, reduce value of entry level contracts and lengthen the term, limit the length of UFA contracts, remove the ability for teams to hide salary in the minors, remove many forms of salary arbitration but, really nothing that has been proposed that is a “win” for the players.

Posted by hockey1919 from mid-atlantic on 10/26/12 at 09:13 AM ET

phillyd's avatar

I’m with HD on this one guys. I personally don’t think the players are going to get a better offer from the owners then what they put forth last week. If the players think it’s a process, Fehr has all sold them an empty bag of goods. We’ll see replacement players long before we see a deal anywhere close to what the NHLPA has proposed or even what the NHL offered last week. Remember, the MLB strike of 1994 didn’t get rectified until after the start of spring training in 1995 with replacement ball players.

Posted by phillyd from Southern New Jersey on 10/26/12 at 11:20 AM ET

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I personally don’t think the players are going to get a better offer from the owners then what they put forth last week

But that deal is still better than the last “final” offer. If the last lockout proved anything, the owners will eventaully ratify a deal that makes it look like they won and then spend the next five years undercutting each other to the benefit of the players. What Fehr is probably working on right now is the loopholes that allow the owners to hang themselves again. If the players just cave under the first threat they are looking at 40% of the revenue in the next CBA and that in part is why they need the owners to feel a little pressure as well.

Posted by hockey1919 from mid-atlantic on 10/26/12 at 12:04 PM ET

phillyd's avatar

If the players just cave under the first threat they are looking at 40% of the revenue in the next CBA [/quote

I go back and forth on that thinking as well. To me, as long as the other leagues are pretty much at 50/50 (those that have a cap anyways), I don’t see that as major an issue as it could be. Yes, that’s a big if, but I can’t see the NFLPA or the NBAPA caving less than that (I do know someone is at 49%).

Posted by phillyd from Southern New Jersey on 10/26/12 at 12:16 PM ET

redxblack's avatar

The players have other leagues to go to while the NHL practices being dysfunctional. That’s not really the case in other sports.

Posted by redxblack from Akron Ohio on 10/26/12 at 01:04 PM ET

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other leagues are pretty much at 50/50

But isn’t that a relatively new position and now so easily accepted as the norm?  If NFL revenues go even higher over the next ten years, I can see the NFL saying to the players take 40%, since it is 40% of a bigger pie.  The players are still making “enough” money, fans will say the players are just going to blow it anyway. There is a certain perverse logic to the fact that once you accept the flawed premise that as long as you are making “enough” you are getting your fair share and therefore you don’t deserve any more.

Posted by hockey1919 from mid-atlantic on 10/26/12 at 02:18 PM ET

phillyd's avatar

I don’t disagree with either or you, I was just making that statement and yeah, next time around we could be looking at 40% as the norm. I will throw this back out, however, in private industry one tends to shoot for between 20 and 30% profit margin (while more is always great), government contractors tend to shoot for 10-12% on their contracts. If the NHL owners, collectively, are receiving right now, on average across 30 teams, about 5%, if you believe the numbers thrown out there in other articles, even on the high end, doesn’t that mean something has to give significantly. And isn’t the only significant thing the % of HRR the players get, or at least, the most significant cost? I want to watch hockey as much as anyone but I also want all of the leagues franchises to be stable as well (and move them if they can’t succeed coming out of this lockout).

Personally, just from where I sit and seeing what’s going on, I don’t think the players are going to avoid a rollback in salaries, I just don’t. That doesn’t mean I like having someones contract basically torn up or a piece of it torn up, I just don’t see how the economics work moving forward without doing that. I still like my idea of 75% of contract now, 25% in deferred payments, but the NHLPA rejected the deferred type of payments (I know, it wasn’t really clear but they’ve labeled it as such) in the NHLs offer. I do think they should make the contracts “whole” but I just don’t see how they can do it without some kind of deferred system.

Anyways, I’ll continue the discussion after I go out and get propane, water, gas, dry ice, and non-perishables for Sunday-Wednesday.

Posted by phillyd from Southern New Jersey on 10/26/12 at 02:32 PM ET

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