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Abel to Yzerman

With 3 Hours To Go, Holland Gives Vanek Away

It wasn't 2:45. It wasn't a deal that got faxed in at 3:20. Three hours before the deadline, actually 3 hours and 15 minutes before the deadline, Red Wing GM Ken Holland sent Tomas Vanek to Florida for a 3rd round pick and an AHL'er who's already been waived once in his career.

It's not the return, necessarily. And it's not the timing, specifically. It's the combination of the two that should convince anyone in doubt that Ken Holland truly needs to go. Immediately.

Oh, and then various sources report that Holland is "done for the day." Just when you think the ineptitude has reached its absolute worst, this.

We now know that Ken Holland has no capacity to make a trade when the Wings are contenders, no ability to convince UFAs of any value to come to Detroit, and a newfound amazing skillset: he's discovered how fun it is to get absolutely bent over on deadline day. We're used to the apathy. We're used to the shoulder shrugs and the Eeyore routine, the kicking of tires. That we've become almost numb to.

But this deal is disgusting. With three hours left, you get a 3rd rounder with a minor leaguer who's failed for arguably the hottest ticket on the Deadline Day dance card. Trades are hard. Unless you get screwed. Then, apparently, it's real damn easy. Fire Ken Holland. ASAP.

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Comments

stonehands-78's avatar

“The Art of the Deal”

‘... making the Wings great again’

By Tick-Tock Holland

Posted by stonehands-78 from the beginning ... a WingsFan, on 03/01/17 at 01:42 PM ET

topshelf14's avatar

He’s a terrible general manager. And does not deserve to be in charge of the best organization in all of sports.

Posted by topshelf14 from Detroit, MI on 03/01/17 at 01:50 PM ET

Nathan's avatar

The thing of him saying “he’s done” is the most infuriating part. I can understand that Vanek’s value may be suppressed because he’s already openly expressed interest in returning right back to Detroit, so he’s as pure a rental as you can get (and his last two stints in the playoffs were putrid, and he’s been used to situational effectiveness by Blashill that might be less feasible for potential suitors).

But how can you say you’re done? It might be true, but… the fuq.

The thing is, the reason Kenny is “done” today is because the guys that should be decent trade chips for kicking off a rebuild—Tatar and Nyquist—should’ve been shopped heavily last year, if not the year before (at least one of the two, anyhow). Instead, they’ve been held onto too long, only to see their production dip even further, and now they’re just a bit too old and too well paid that the whole “change of scenery” thing looks attractive to other teams.

Being done today is a culmination of mistakes of years past.

Even if you want to give Kenny a flier and say that he was following Mr. I’s instructions these last few years, I still think you have to clean house. It’s time for a reset of the front office, and as much as I think Blashill got a raw deal with the roster he was handed, it’s his time to go, too.

Posted by Nathan from the scoresheet! on 03/01/17 at 01:53 PM ET

nEgativezEro's avatar

Ehhh, the market for him didn’t seem like it was heating up any. I thought he would at least get a 2nd rounder, but even that market may have not been there for Vanek. While he’s been good for Detroit, he’s a PP specialist and not far removed from being bought out for being terrible.

There’s a high likelihood that Minnesota overpayed a bit for Hanzel. I’m all for dumping on Holland for all the dumb moves he’s made. While this return is underwhelming, I’d rather Holland make the deal as is, than have their potentially only suitor back out and make another move.

I’ll reserve more judgment when we see what Iginla/Vrbata end up costing their new teams. Holland got solid value out of Jurco and Smith. I’m inclined to give Kenny the benefit of the doubt in THIS instance.

Posted by nEgativezEro on 03/01/17 at 01:57 PM ET

RWBill's avatar

What is this, some kind of bust?
Is this some kind of bust?

Posted by RWBill on 03/01/17 at 02:03 PM ET

RWBill's avatar

Ken Holland

Posted by RWBill on 03/01/17 at 02:09 PM ET

Avatar

I’m not sure why you’re writing a post complaining about a trade when everyone here has limited information as to how many teams were actually wanting Vanek.

He played in limited situations and was extremely sheltered, hence his average of 10-12min of ice time every game.

Any GM could easily see this and so they weren’t going to throw it all away when his history clearly indicates he doesn’t perform at any higher levels based on the past 2 times he was traded.

No one here knows if this was the best offer or not. KH is not an idiot. If someone came and said here’s a 2nd rounder, he would OBVIOUSLY take the 2nd rounder over a 3rd rounder.

Waiting until the last minute for a deal to magically fall in your lap is bad management. If the best deal you’re going to get finally happens then you take it. You don’t say “Hey hold all your plans so I can see if you get more desperate even though I might get stuck with Vanek and then all the pocket GMs will think I sat on my hands even though they have no idea about how trade deals work”

This is a great example of complaining but not actually fully understanding the intricacies of the trade.

You should delete this rant.

It’s embarrassing.

Posted by retrospecd on 03/01/17 at 02:11 PM ET

IwoCPO's avatar

KH is not an idiot.

I stopped reading after that.

Please post scanned proof of your pharmacist’s degree.

Posted by IwoCPO from Sunny San Diego, bitches on 03/01/17 at 02:16 PM ET

ilovehomers's avatar

Posted by retrospecd on 03/01/17 at 01:11 PM ET

Kenny? Is this what you do after you’re done making trades?

Posted by ilovehomers on 03/01/17 at 02:23 PM ET

Vladimir16's avatar

You should delete this rant.

It’s embarrassing.

Posted by retrospecd on 03/01/17 at 01:11 PM ET


Hahahaha…. you funny.

The volume of evidence that Sir Kenny Holland is a bad general manager is piling up. High! How long is it going to take for Chris Ilitch to do something? Is Jim Devellano watching this slow sinking of the Titanic? I know he used to care.
I feel like a battered spouse. After the Helm signing I told myself to be done caring about the Wings until they quit acting a fool, much like I did with the Lions. And yet I can’t quit them AAAARRRGGGHHH!!!!!!
The Emporer’s new clothes.

Posted by Vladimir16 from Grand River Valley on 03/01/17 at 02:25 PM ET

Nathan's avatar

He’s a terrible general manager. And does not deserve to be in charge of the best organization in all of sports.

Posted by topshelf14 from Detroit, MI on 03/01/17 at 12:50 PM ET

Sad to say, but I’ve got some snake oil to sell you if you think the Wings are the best organization in sports… I would’ve still bought that a few years ago had they started properly rebuilding then. But that ship sailed a while ago. They have a very long way to go to get back to being a respectable club.

Posted by Nathan from the scoresheet! on 03/01/17 at 02:29 PM ET

Avatar

If this is just going to be the rants of personal feelings then you should preface every post with “This is simply a rant with no evidence to support the legitimacy of my statements. Please proceed with caution”

That way people can decide whether they want to waste their time. Time they’ll never get back.

Also, you can list every single idiotic trade or signing of every GM. Every GM has done them.

How do you think Dallas feels right now? They thought they were on the cusp of winning and yet they are selling off assets left and right.

The problem here, is everyone only looks at the situations within their own little silo. They never take into account other teams when posting nonsense on sites or forums. When you compare against other teams, it’s not the end of the world.

How’s TB doing right now? Those guys won it 5 years in a row with SY didn’t they? I mean because SY is so damn good at being a GM, why wouldn’t they win every year?

Posted by retrospecd on 03/01/17 at 02:45 PM ET

ilovehomers's avatar

If this is just going to be the rants of personal feelings then you should preface every post with “This is simply a rant with no evidence to support the legitimacy of my statements. Please proceed with caution”

Or you could just not read the blog, snowflake. The world doesn’t revolve around you.

Posted by ilovehomers on 03/01/17 at 02:46 PM ET

Avatar

i’m actually forced to defend holland.  congratulations universe…you win.  here goes:

of all the bad decision made by Ken Holland in the last 4-5 years (and there are definitely many), this one is really not that bad.

anyone with some perspective would realize that Vanek returned a conditional 2nd when he was traded to Montreal, and that was before 1) his recent playoff failures, and 2) publicly stating he was testing the market.

did you think he would return more than that now?

i mean come on.

no one wanted to give up a 2nd for a Vanek rental.  it wasn’t going to happen.

that’s Holland’s fault…how, exactly?

hope that helps.

Posted by incompetent GM on 03/01/17 at 03:00 PM ET

stonehands-78's avatar

Posted by retrospecd on 03/01/17 at 01:45 PM ET

are you new to A2Y?

... just wondering.

Posted by stonehands-78 from the beginning ... a WingsFan, on 03/01/17 at 03:12 PM ET

awould's avatar

If this is just going to be the rants of personal feelings then you should preface every post with “This is simply a rant with no evidence to support the legitimacy of my statements. Please proceed with caution”

“Rants of personal feelings” is basically the definition of a sports blog, not sure what you expected or why you continued to waste your personal time by reading it and, in the face of all the irony, to then post a rant of your personal feelings in the comments.

Posted by awould on 03/01/17 at 04:01 PM ET

Primis's avatar

I won’t lie, Chief.

Looking at what the prices are for other deals…. the Vanek price isn’t out of line.

It’s starting to look decent enough.

Posted by Primis on 03/01/17 at 04:35 PM ET

awould's avatar

Posted by Primis on 03/01/17 at 03:35 PM ET

Vanek is a pure rental, hard to get a huge bargain out of it. I’m still wondering why so many 3rd rounders are stockpiled for the 2017 draft….

Posted by awould on 03/01/17 at 04:43 PM ET

Mr. Fnytelhatt's avatar

If this is just going to be the rants of personal feelings then you should preface every post with “This is simply a rant with no evidence to support the legitimacy of my statements. Please proceed with caution”.

Haha, please make this happen.

Posted by Mr. Fnytelhatt on 03/01/17 at 04:53 PM ET

Primis's avatar

Vanek is a pure rental, hard to get a huge bargain out of it. I’m still wondering why so many 3rd rounders are stockpiled for the 2017 draft….

Posted by awould on 03/01/17 at 03:43 PM ET

And now seeing the prices for Streit and Stafford….. I think I get it.

For a couple years, 2nd rounders were the main currency of choice.

This year, because of how compressed the standings are, and the fact there are very few “sellers”, one would naturally think that it would drive the price *up* of those available players.

Instead though, it actually drove the prices *down*, because there are too many teams that don’t feel comfortable “going for it” and not willing to get into the action.

Vanek for a 3rd and a minor “prospect” (though I think McIlrath is hot garbage) makes sense.  Seeing what others have gone for…. I genuinely think Holland got the best deal he could get.

It’s unfortunate that it’s a really bad year to be a seller at the deadline, to go along with what should be kinda’ a crappy draft pool.

Posted by Primis on 03/01/17 at 05:32 PM ET

bigdee89's avatar

Posted by retrospecd on 03/01/17 at 01:45 PM ET

Pretty much every single contract signing made by Kenny except the players he was able to trade away is why Kenny is s bad GM.  Do you like Ericsson, Glendenning or Helm?  Do you think they’re core players?  Because if you’re rebuilding you should trade away non-core players for assets.  Good luck trading away any of those albatrosses.

We’re stuck with shit players for years now because of Kenny.  Enjoy finishing in the basement for many years. because of your awesome GM.  It’s going to get ridiculous if any of those contracts like Kronwall or Zetterberg retire early with cap penalties.

Yes we have some nice young players but they’re no McDavid and they need support.  The crap players like Errorson are not support.  They’re just crap.

So yay we got a 3rd and a low end prospect?  Nice work on the rebuild.  It’s going to be a long ten years.

 

Posted by bigdee89 from The Great White North Eh? on 03/01/17 at 06:14 PM ET

Avatar

radio silence from IwoCPO after he was shown to be absolutely clueless…

Posted by incompetent GM on 03/01/17 at 10:41 PM ET

ilovehomers's avatar

Posted by incompetent GM on 03/01/17 at 09:41 PM ET

Calm down, tough guy.

Posted by ilovehomers on 03/02/17 at 01:27 AM ET

Primis's avatar

radio silence from IwoCPO after he was shown to be absolutely clueless…

Posted by incompetent GM on 03/01/17 at 09:41 PM ET

Not really.  At the time it was posted, the Vanek trade was the *only* deal that had gone down, and you had absolutely nothing to compare it to except for prices in previous seasons’ deadlines.  And by those metrics, the Vanek deal was *awful*.

That 3 hours later it suddenly made sense doesn’t change a reaction 3 hours prior.  We were all *howling*...

But you see Iginla go for a 4th, Stafford for a 6th (the same price as Ott, and Stafford is about 15 times the player Ott is, that one in particular boggles my mind)... and you then really start to understand how disinterested the buying market was in forwards in general.  Buyers were very ready to take them or leave them, either way.

And if you cant understand a knee-jerk blog post….. then A2Y probably isn’t for you.

Posted by Primis on 03/02/17 at 11:41 AM ET

Slumpy's avatar

Kenny had a early tee time so the early trade justifies it surely

vampire

Posted by Slumpy from Under My Wheels on 03/02/17 at 01:53 PM ET

Primis's avatar

Chief…. Blashill just told HSJ he still thinks Henrik Zetterberg is leading DET to the playoffs.

I’m…. I’m pretty sure you have thoughts on this.  I really am pretty sure you do.  *nod nod*

Posted by Primis on 03/03/17 at 03:22 PM ET

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About Abel to Yzerman

Welcome to Abel to Yzerman, a Red Wing blog since 1977.  No other site on the internet has better-researched, fact-laden and better prepared discussions than A2Y.  Re-phrase: we do little research, find facts and stats highly overrated and claim little to no preparation.  There are 19 readers of A2Y. No more, no less. All of them, except maybe one, are juvenile in nature.  Reminding them of that in the comment section will only encourage them to prove that. Your suggestions and critiques are welcome: wphoulihan@gmail.com