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Abel to Yzerman

17 Left. Kenny?

And now Cotsonika’s just going flat-out BFF with the Holland talk.

@cotsonika

Wings fans saying it’s what-have-you-done-for-me-lately. Um, Cup in ‘08, Game 7 in ‘09, 21 straight playoffs, offers for Parise, Suter

I’ll tell you this: if we land a few critical pieces between now and whenever, I’ll be with you Nick.  But Tootoo, Samuelsson, Gustavsson and Brunner aren’t cutting it…not when he’s admitted for nearly a year that upgrades are sorely needed and today’s the day to do it.

Update: interesting statement from Nick Cotsonika.

@cotsonika

cotsonika: Amazing how Ken Holland has not earned the benefit of the doubt among at least some of the Detroit fan base.

Well…has the team improved since we lost to Bubba?  Money to spend, Nick. Holes to fill.  Homer’s gone? Tootoo.  Hudler? Sammy.  A backup goalie? Got it.  Brunner? Untested.  Tell me that if this UFA thing ends today we’d be a favorite.  Land me Suter and we’ll talk about benefit of the doubt.

A bit more below on why I think Semin may not be an option any longer.

On the record:  like the Gustavsson deal.  Re-phrase: Really dig that deal.

Samuelsson?  The money Hudler deserves with a bit more production and grit, but not much more.  I’m neutral.

Absolutely despise the Tootoo signing.  I honestly dislike this player and I’m not sure I’ll be able to set that aside. 

I don’t believe we’re in the running for Parise and I’m not sure Semin is an option either. If that’s the case and William Tell plus Tootoo are the “plan b” options? Failure.

I think we’re still in it for Suter. 

And just to repeat: the Tootoo signing disgusts me.

Question from our very own agitator, Garth: why do I believe Semin isn’t an option anymore? Because if we get Suter for 10, and it’s going to take 10, that leaves us 7 with a few moves to go. I still think Knuble’s coming (although the Tootoo signing may have done away with that).  I just don’t see the Wings signing 4 more forwards (including Brunner), Suter and a goalie. 

But, a trade could very well be happening as we speak, too.  You’ve read that we’re in on Nash…ok.  And the BJ’s wanted Gustavsson. Maybe they’ll get him, along with Tootoo. 

If we get Semin and Suter, but miss out on Parise?  I’m reluctantly ok with that, when you consider all else that’s gone down.

And if we land Nash, along with Suter? I’m reservedly ok with that too…depending on who and what we give up to get him.

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Comments

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Kate from Pa.-made in Detroit's avatar

Serenity now.=Alcohol now.

Lets Go Red Wings!!!!! In ’13

Posted by Kate from Pa.-made in Detroit on 07/01/12 at 09:29 PM ET

RWBill's avatar

I like the idea of an agitator, but not a stupid dumbphuchk like tootoo.  He actually is stupid.

If somehow he is still around and - gag me with a Paul Bunyon’s soup spoon - actually wearing the coveted red and white winged wheel come October, I’ll cheer all his agitation up to the point where he falls back in character and hits people 100 feet from the puck and puts us in a PK over and over.  Because that will most assuredly happen.

Posted by RWBill from cruising Brush Street with creepy Rob Lowe. on 07/01/12 at 09:30 PM ET

monkey's avatar

FOOTLOOSE.  Holy shit, now THAT is a nickname.  Jordin “Footloose” Tootoo.  Let’s make this happen.

Posted by monkey from Finland on 07/01/12 at 09:30 PM ET

WestWing's avatar

Taking a deep breath here.

Gustavson is a good signing.  A clear upgrade to a young, athletic NHL goaltender who has some upside to his game.

Sammy basically replaces Hudler.  Bigger.  Stronger.  More responsible on the defensive side of the puck.  Right-hand shot.  Much better suited to be slotted up and down the lineup.  Put it this way, I’d rather have Samuelsson on the third line than Hudler on the second line.  This assumes we still have a top six forward on the way of course.  If that happens, then I’m okay with this move. 

Jordin TooToo.  I’m going to try to get my head around this.  I’m trying really hard to set aside personal hatred of the guy.  I know Babcock has been harping on the need to be “harder to play against”, and I guess in some ways this move accomplishes that.

Bottom line, we’re still in need of a top-pairing D-man and a top six forward.  With so many forwards in the mix, a trade would make perfect sense.  Suter, Garrison and a deal for a scorer?  Again, there’s a reason I don’t play this guessing game.  What I just said makes too much fuching sense.  Therefore it probably doesn’t stand a chance in hell of actually happening.

Posted by WestWing from Portland, Oregon on 07/01/12 at 09:31 PM ET

topshelf14's avatar

Abby takes terrible penalties at the most critical points of important games.  Tootoo will be there to fight, hit and agitate. And Abby is looking for over 2 mil per, therefore more than him.

Posted by topshelf14 from Detroit, MI on 07/01/12 at 09:32 PM ET

monkey's avatar

Much better suited to be slotted up and down the lineup.

Which one gives up more short handed opportunities from the point?

Posted by monkey from Finland on 07/01/12 at 09:33 PM ET

RWBill's avatar

KH on Friday -  “We’ve already got 13 forwards, but are they the right ones?”

No, because there was an abundance of third and fourth liners.  So we add 2 more third and fourth liners.

Trade trade trade waiver waiver waiver.

Posted by RWBill from cruising Brush Street with creepy Rob Lowe. on 07/01/12 at 09:33 PM ET

Primis's avatar

It’s like this, and it’s simple:  I cannot, and will not, root for a team that employs both Bertuzzi and Tootoo.

Either one or the two has to go, or I’m done.  I will not waver on this…

Posted by Primis on 07/01/12 at 09:35 PM ET

mrfluffy's avatar

Costinkowhatever is right Chief. This is far from over. The people that are crying for Holland’s head are idiots.

Posted by mrfluffy from A wide spot on I-90 in Montana on 07/01/12 at 09:36 PM ET

Avatar

Hard to believe we’ll have money for suter and semin. Because we’re definately getting suter. I’d rather not have semin due to the fact that every time I see his name in a sentence I giggle like a schoolgirl. Or is it…...gurgle LOL

Posted by Keyser S. from http://www.theredwingsforum.com on 07/01/12 at 07:27 PM ET

Nice.

I’m most pissed about Samuelsson, actually. I like the Tootoo signing…quite a bit in fact. He’ll probably be the guy who has to defend the team when Samuelsson slaps the opposition in the face while the officials are breaking up scrums.

God, I hate Samuelsson.

Posted by godblender on 07/01/12 at 09:37 PM ET

monkey's avatar

The people that are crying for Holland’s head are idiots.

They’re gonna kill that poor woman, man!

Posted by monkey from Finland on 07/01/12 at 09:37 PM ET

Avatar

I’ve heard from reliable sources that Knuble was saying the Wings wouldn’t sign him as far back as May.

Posted by TimRoss on 07/01/12 at 09:38 PM ET

Avatar

A week ago I said that Red Wings Nation was terrified that post July 1, Detroit would no longer be Hockeytown.  The Wings needed to land 2 of the 3 following names to lay legitimate claim to Hockeytown: Suter, Semin, Parise. Sadly, looks like Hockeytown is just another name on ice.  Tootoo, Sammy aren’t signed if Wings get their Plan A scorer/sniper.  Can’t believe I fell for that suter/parise package deal BS.

Posted by beelza on 07/01/12 at 09:38 PM ET

Primis's avatar

As far as trades… yeah, there has to be a trade.  Probably it’s a gambit for Nash.  We came in knowing some kids would not have homes on the roster next season, and now we have even more kids that are going to be shut out as it stands now.

If I’m Fil, Emmerton, Mursak, Kindl, Ericsson,and Abdelkader, I’m waiting and a bundle of nerves because the likeliehoos is a combo of us is going somewhere in a trade.

Abby takes terrible penalties at the most critical points of important games.  Tootoo will be there to fight, hit and agitate. And Abby is looking for over 2 mil per, therefore more than him.

Posted by topshelf14 from Hockeytown, USA on 07/01/12 at 07:32 PM ET

Abby also isn’t the piece of human excrement Tootoo is.  I’d take Abby 100 times out of 100.

Posted by Primis on 07/01/12 at 09:39 PM ET

RWBill's avatar

Could Johan Franzen be someone we would trade?  Up to me? Depending on the trade, yes for sure.

We are way bloated on forwards at the moment.

Alcohol now.

Posted by RWBill from cruising Brush Street with creepy Rob Lowe. on 07/01/12 at 09:40 PM ET

Primis's avatar

Hey, remember back when DET wasn’t CGY where they just recycled UFA’s that had already flamed out with them once?

Posted by Primis on 07/01/12 at 09:41 PM ET

RWBill's avatar

Either one or the two has to go, or I’m done.  I will not waver on this…
Posted by Primis on 07/01/12 at 07:35 PM ET

I’m holding you to that.

Posted by RWBill from cruising Brush Street with creepy Rob Lowe. on 07/01/12 at 09:42 PM ET

HockeytownOverhaul's avatar

Tootoo and Helm apparently close.. should help bottom 6 gel.  Helm and him are both hell on wheels on the ice and hopefully hell be up for rounding out his game with a good support system and friends around

Posted by HockeytownOverhaul on 07/01/12 at 09:43 PM ET

IwoCPO's avatar

Costinkowhatever is right Chief. This is far from over. The people that are crying for Holland’s head are idiots.

Posted by mrfluffy from Long Beach on 07/01/12 at 07:36 PM ET

I’m definitely willing to accept that Fluffy.  It irritates me when the MSM go high and mighty, though, and tell me when I can and can’t be concerned. He also, by the way, just described Wing fans as “spoiled.” 

Bring me Suter and all is forgiven, Kenny.  But I’ll tell you this: if it’s Suter and everyone else we’ve signed today, are the Wings better than last year?

Posted by IwoCPO from Sunny San Diego, bitches on 07/01/12 at 09:44 PM ET

CRoy's avatar

And the Hasek is filling up early this year.. Jack and Coke please.. double

Posted by CRoy from Redford MI on 07/01/12 at 09:44 PM ET

ITDeuce's avatar

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention.  I like the Monster signing, and am also “meh” on the Sammy signing.  Actually I could grow to like that signing, I really like Sammy, just not on the point.  Which is unfortunately where he will be on the second powerplay unit… getting burned by opposing forwards for a shorty.  fml

Please don’t be done Tick Tock.  Please.

I’m going to take my Sunday Sauna now.  And I have several Poet Oatmeal Stouts that will be joining me.  Although, it is every one for themselves down there and not all of the Stouts will make it out alive.  But by the time I come back, we will have traded away TooToo, to someone and signed Parise, and Suter.  Unless we could get Semin for bargain basement prices, I would actually be against that one.

Posted by ITDeuce from The Sunny High Desert on 07/01/12 at 09:45 PM ET

Avatar

Ok. Time out. Aren’t the wings allowed to be OVER the cap by up to 10 million as long as they get down to cap by the start of the season. If so, we still have the money.

Then again, this is what I’m telling myself to remain sane.

Posted by ElCapitan on 07/01/12 at 09:46 PM ET

mrfluffy's avatar

I’m signing off as you guys are beyond pathetic. In March we all said we missed Sammy’s mouth, AND we needed more veterans with scoring knacks. Now you all are pissed. What a bunch of whiny hitches.

Posted by mrfluffy from A wide spot on I-90 in Montana on 07/01/12 at 09:47 PM ET

RWBill's avatar

Wings fans are ready to jump all over Ken Holland.

Posted by RWBill from cruising Brush Street with creepy Rob Lowe. on 07/01/12 at 09:48 PM ET

perfection's avatar

these signings are virtually irrelevant… the success or failure of this offseason is solely dependent on whether or not we pick up a #1 dman. Getting Suter for nothing would be a huge score. Getting Yandle or someone else in a trade would sting but would still be salvaging the team. But if we have to sign the likes of Sammy and Tootoo in order to do WHAT IT TAKES to get Suter, it’s totally worth it to me. I can do without either Semin or Parise if we get Suter. I’d rather have Suter than BOTH Semin and Parise. Kenny’s working it pretty hard.

Posted by perfection from LaLaLand on 07/01/12 at 09:48 PM ET

IwoCPO's avatar

AND we needed more veterans with scoring knacks.

is that Tootoo? I’m just checking.

The guy is a piece of garbage.  If he’s not traded, I’m going to resent this signing for years to come.

Posted by IwoCPO from Sunny San Diego, bitches on 07/01/12 at 09:49 PM ET

mrfluffy's avatar

Oh fuch it…stupid kindle.

Posted by mrfluffy from A wide spot on I-90 in Montana on 07/01/12 at 09:49 PM ET

Primis's avatar

Either one or the two has to go, or I’m done.  I will not waver on this…
Posted by Primis on 07/01/12 at 07:35 PM ET

I’m holding you to that.

Posted by RWBill from hiding indoors from Virginia heat. on 07/01/12 at 07:42 PM ET

I’m perfectly fine with that.  The Lions have rewarded me a million times over for dropping their sorry afts when it became clear character and integrity meant nothing anymore.

I don’t like this.  This is not the Wing Way.  Tootoo actually stands for every single thing that is NOT the Wing Way.  This isn’t the 1980’s where heck yes, throw Probert out there between doing lines of coke and cans of beer.  I don’t care what other organizations are doing, I don’t see why we need to f*ck up ours just to fit in…

Posted by Primis on 07/01/12 at 09:49 PM ET

ITDeuce's avatar

Bring me Suter and all is forgiven, Kenny.  But I’ll tell you this: if it’s Suter and everyone else we’ve signed today, are the Wings better than last year?

Posted by IwoCPO from Sunny San Diego, bitches on 07/01/12 at 07:44 PM ET

No.

Posted by ITDeuce from The Sunny High Desert on 07/01/12 at 09:50 PM ET

topshelf14's avatar

Samuelson at 3 mill is terrible. Boyes signed for 1 mill. Paranteau 4. Sammy is 3 yrs older and so so so fragile. Injured every year. Although tootoo is a dbag, we need that on this team more than all the nice guys we’ve had.

Posted by topshelf14 from Detroit, MI on 07/01/12 at 09:50 PM ET

IwoCPO's avatar

Garrison to Vancouver. Tick fuching Tock.

Posted by IwoCPO from Sunny San Diego, bitches on 07/01/12 at 09:52 PM ET

RWBill's avatar

Yes, the Wings are at 22 rostered, paid players with $17M in cap space remaining.

Posted by RWBill from cruising Brush Street with creepy Rob Lowe. on 07/01/12 at 09:52 PM ET

Jeff  OKWingnut's avatar

But I’ll tell you this: if it’s Suter and everyone else we’ve signed today, are the Wings better than last year?

Marginally.

Sammy is an upgrade from Midget Pimp.  At least he shoots, no telling where it is going, but he shoots.

And if we miss out on the Suter sweepstakes - we are screwed.

Posted by Jeff OKWingnut from Quest for 12 on 07/01/12 at 09:52 PM ET

IwoCPO's avatar

Maybe Ilitch thought he was signing Tootoo for the Tigers to fulfill Leyland’s fantasy of more “dirtbags”?

Posted by IwoCPO from Sunny San Diego, bitches on 07/01/12 at 09:52 PM ET

calquake's avatar

I watch, I wait and then I criticize after the fact.

Posted by calquake on 07/01/12 at 09:53 PM ET

Primis's avatar

is that Tootoo? I’m just checking.

The guy is a piece of garbage.  If he’s not traded, I’m going to resent this signing for years to come.

Posted by IwoCPO from Sunny San Diego, bitches on 07/01/12 at 07:49 PM ET

Hell yes.  This is the Detroit Red Wings, not some classless thing like THE Ohio State University where cheating isn’t trying or something.

I’m signing off as you guys are beyond pathetic. In March we all said we missed Sammy’s mouth, AND we needed more veterans with scoring knacks. Now you all are pissed. What a bunch of whiny hitches.

Posted by mrfluffy from Long Beach on 07/01/12 at 07:47 PM ET

I’m unenthused with Sammy, but not distraught.  To me, signing Sammy is like waving a white flag though, like Holland doesn’t expect to land any bigger fish.  I know Sammy can be an agitator and we’ve missed that though.

Posted by Primis on 07/01/12 at 09:54 PM ET

Keyser S.'s avatar

Helm - Tootoo line could do some damage. Major damage.

Posted by Keyser S. on 07/01/12 at 09:55 PM ET

WestWing's avatar

Garrison off the board.  Options dwindling.

Posted by WestWing from Portland, Oregon on 07/01/12 at 09:56 PM ET

mrfluffy's avatar

Primis, at least you rationalize what you think…its others on here that obviously get my goat.

I worked hard for that goat and I don’t rent her out cheap for just anyone.

Posted by mrfluffy from A wide spot on I-90 in Montana on 07/01/12 at 09:57 PM ET

HockeytownOverhaul's avatar

WWhy do i have to like or agree with your opinions?  Im not mad some people are happy about our pickups.. im pissed i dont like them.. wtf is your excuse?

Carle or suter now.. *#$%@&.  Suter or bust

Posted by HockeytownOverhaul on 07/01/12 at 10:00 PM ET

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Welcome to Abel to Yzerman, a Red Wing blog since 1977.  No other site on the internet has better-researched, fact-laden and better prepared discussions than A2Y.  Re-phrase: we do little research, find facts and stats highly overrated and claim little to no preparation.  There are 19 readers of A2Y. No more, no less. All of them, except maybe one, are juvenile in nature.  Reminding them of that in the comment section will only encourage them to prove that. Your suggestions and critiques are welcome: wphoulihan@gmail.com